'05 CDI "communication fault" N14/2 Glow Output Stage 2538-4 jay-bob? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

ROLLGUY · #16 12-23-2022, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimFreeh

I still don't think I'm getting my point across.... Let's try it this way.

Right now, today at this moment can you communicate with the CDI control module N3/9? Can you get a menu that shows you options to take to read codes or look at live data in the N3/9 module?

I have a couple of aftermarket scan tools that I use as a backup to my SDS system, its not at all uncommon for those tools to not communicate with some of the control modules in the car. I've also seen them communicate with a module on one day and not communicate on another day.

Yes I can, and have been able to (with my Icarsoft MB II) establish communication with the CDI control module N3/9, and can view a list of current and stored codes (six total), but get a communication fault when I scroll down and highlight clear fault memory (second photo post 5). I will try jay_bob's test as described in post 12 later today. I have not tried to view the live data, so I will look at that as well.

ROLLGUY · #17 12-23-2022, 03:51 PM

It seems to me that the alternator is communicating, at least that is the way it appears in this video; https://photos.app.goo.gl/Dz5empcYjqEHCmXt9
Although it only gets to 14.1 volts, and I did start it once before making the video, the voltage does raise gradually.

Also, I tried to scan codes again, and I could not even access most of the modules without getting a communication error. However, I was able to access the diagnostic section, and got a 930C and 930E.

TimFreeh · #18 12-25-2022, 12:22 PM

Based on your video and Jaybob's excellent rendition on the N3/9 architecture it looks like your new alternator is indeed in communication with N3/9 and under its control.

But since the check engine light and glow plug light on the dash are still on I'm guessing there still is some sort of issues with communications between N3/9 and the glow plug controller N14/2.

Since the error with the glow plug controller happened at the same time your new alternator was installed I'm still thinking there is some sort of incompatibility between the new alternator and the LIN bus that is causing issues with the communication to N14/2.

But from the images in your last post it appears to me that your "MBII" scan tool is having problems communicating with your car at this point in time. Both errors seem to be telling you the MBII scan tool can't initiate communications to the car. I have no idea what a 'knowledge base error' and a 'synchronization of the DTC " means - do you have any documentation or guidance with the MBII scan tool that info on 930E or 930C error codes?

I don't think those codes are MB-specific, I think they're associated with the MBII scan tool?

At any rate until you can get the MBII scan tool back into communicating with N3/9 or come up with another scan tool that can you're kind of unable to proceed.

dieselbenz1 · #19 12-25-2022, 03:39 PM

With engine running you have communication errors?
With engine not running you can see modules but not clear codes?

ROLLGUY · #20 12-26-2022, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimFreeh

Based on your video and Jaybob's excellent rendition on the N3/9 architecture it looks like your new alternator is indeed in communication with N3/9 and under its control.

But since the check engine light and glow plug light on the dash are still on I'm guessing there still is some sort of issues with communications between N3/9 and the glow plug controller N14/2.

Since the error with the glow plug controller happened at the same time your new alternator was installed I'm still thinking there is some sort of incompatibility between the new alternator and the LIN bus that is causing issues with the communication to N14/2.

But from the images in your last post it appears to me that your "MBII" scan tool is having problems communicating with your car at this point in time. Both errors seem to be telling you the MBII scan tool can't initiate communications to the car. I have no idea what a 'knowledge base error' and a 'synchronization of the DTC " means - do you have any documentation or guidance with the MBII scan tool that info on 930E or 930C error codes?

I don't think those codes are MB-specific, I think they're associated with the MBII scan tool?

At any rate until you can get the MBII scan tool back into communicating with N3/9 or come up with another scan tool that can you're kind of unable to proceed.

I am still doing research on 930C&E. I found this so far:
https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w211/695674-what-caused-error-code-930c.html

It may be a problem with my scanner, so I will take an hour (or more) today, and hook up my extremely slow SDS computer, and see if it (and I) can figure it out.

ROLLGUY · #21 12-26-2022, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselbenz1

With engine running you have communication errors?
With engine not running you can see modules but not clear codes?

This problem was only the last time I used my MB II on the car. A couple days ago to make the video, I could access and clear data in every other module save the CDI module. I was able to see the DTC's, but not clear them in only this module. I then tried it the next day, and I got the 930 codes, and could not continue.

Stay tuned, I will get back to the car this afternoon, hopefully with more good info after scanning with my (extremely slow) SDS computer.

dieselbenz1 · #22 12-26-2022, 12:25 PM

Should your scanner operate differently ie not be able to communicate with engine running vs engine not running and scanner working this would indicate? One major difference is the alternator is spinning putting electrical noise on the Lin and causing these scanner issues.

ROLLGUY · #23 12-26-2022, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselbenz1

Should your scanner operate differently ie not be able to communicate with engine running vs engine not running and scanner working this would indicate? One major difference is the alternator is spinning putting electrical noise on the Lin and causing these scanner issues.

I don't think the engine running or not should have any effect on the scanner working or not. I often use it for live data, and that requires the engine to be running.

ROLLGUY · #24 12-26-2022, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselbenz1

The regulator part should be
Mercedes PN: 0031549706
Bosch PN: F00M145225
Others cause lin faults

Consulting with my parts guy, these numbers are not correct for the '05 CDI. He looked up the proper part#, and they are backordered everywhere (his suppliers). I also looked on ebay, and these numbers are not for the CDI either (for C , ML etc).

dieselbenz1 · #25 12-26-2022, 04:03 PM

Ooops didnt mean to misslead you my notes must be wrong.

ROLLGUY · #26 12-26-2022, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselbenz1

Ooops didnt mean to misslead you my notes must be wrong.

No problem, I just want to make sure I get the right part. It is not an easy job to replace the alternator in this car. However, with the new information I have, it may just come to that.

ROLLGUY · #27 12-26-2022, 07:21 PM

After waiting an entire seven minutes for my system to boot up (seemed like an eternity), I got my SDS to work. It showed much of the same information that my MB II did, but I was at least able to clear the stored codes. I also did an alternator test, and according to the SDS, it failed (view photos). It still has the 930 codes, and was no help with how to fix it. I have 11 photos of the screen, and at least 2 issues still remain. Although I don't want to believe it, the alternator test is pretty conclusive. I really do NOT want to R&R it again. Thanks again you guys for all your knowledge and help with this, and I hope the SDS screen photos will help in finding the problem with the car.
One question for the SDS experts: The last photo shows a list of events and codes, have all these happened to this car, or are these just "possible".

ROLLGUY · #28 12-26-2022, 07:30 PM

I am not sure how to fix the problems, as the part of the SDS system that shows diagrams and repair info shows an "Internal Error...... file not found". The 930 code is still there, and the system will not let me go further without displaying the internal error message. This is probably a fault with my software ($99 hard drive from China). Please view photos, and let me know if you have any ideas. Thanks!

TimFreeh · #29 12-27-2022, 09:55 AM

The long list of error codes are the entire set of possible errors with some additional information and troubleshooting sets. They are not indicating the error occurred, you're supposed to use them for specific testing of components like you did with the alternator.

I have no idea what the alternator test is supposed to show. There are voltage lines and current traces so I'd guess N3/9 is supposed to manipulate the voltage regulator via the LIN bus and see associated changes. I don't know if the high/low traces are supposed to be upper/lower limits? Not sure how this test is supposed to work? If N3/9 commands the alternator to ramp-up the alternator to 100 amp delivery where is the associated current supposed to go?

Agree it seems like your version of SDS doesn't like the results of the test.

I've seen the 'file not found' error before on many bootleg SDS systems. I'd guess its just missing data that was not correctly copied by whoever set up the system. Not sure its really fixable, way over my capabilities.

I went on the EPC and looked up the alternator and regulator part numbers for the 211.026 series... there are 4 possible different alternators and 6 different voltage regulators that can be used depending on model year and engine serial number. Kind of a mess.

Are you still getting the unable to communicate with the glow-plug module error?

ROLLGUY · #30 12-27-2022, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimFreeh

The long list of error codes are the entire set of possible errors with some additional information and troubleshooting sets. They are not indicating the error occurred, you're supposed to use them for specific testing of components like you did with the alternator.

I have no idea what the alternator test is supposed to show. There are voltage lines and current traces so I'd guess N3/9 is supposed to manipulate the voltage regulator via the LIN bus and see associated changes. I don't know if the high/low traces are supposed to be upper/lower limits? Not sure how this test is supposed to work? If N3/9 commands the alternator to ramp-up the alternator to 100 amp delivery where is the associated current supposed to go?

Agree it seems like your version of SDS doesn't like the results of the test.

I've seen the 'file not found' error before on many bootleg SDS systems. I'd guess its just missing data that was not correctly copied by whoever set up the system. Not sure its really fixable, way over my capabilities.

I went on the EPC and looked up the alternator and regulator part numbers for the 211.026 series... there are 4 possible different alternators and 6 different voltage regulators that can be used depending on model year and engine serial number. Kind of a mess.

Are you still getting the unable to communicate with the glow-plug module error?

Thanks for your knowledge and willingness to help. I am thankful that the list of error codes is NOT specific to my car!

What I gather about the alternator test is that the top and bottom black lines are the max. and min. limits, and the blue line being the results of the test. Once the test started, the RPM was raised by the computer, and about half way through it said to turn on headlights, rear defroster, and A/C with fan on high. On the lower graph, the blue line dipped below, so I assume that is how it failed the test. I might try doing the test on the other CDI (we have three and a Bluetec between my bro's family and I). I also might swap the voltage regulators as well. The car I am working on belongs to my niece, and she really needs it back. If the problem travels to my car, then I know the regulator is the problem. It is not all that difficult to just replace the regulator. Only the air cleaner box, and intake hose need to be removed. The alternator can then be removed and turned with the regulator facing up to change. To remove the alternator, the coolant needs to be drained, as well as removing the cooling fan and radiator hoses. And yes, my bootleg SDS must be missing something. It also gives me an error (Java?) when accessing the EPC. I am not sure if it is a software or hardware problem ($60 ebay Dell computer). I would love to have that part of the program, as I am always looking up part numbers. I sent an email to my parts guy with the VIN so he can get the correct part number for me. Just looking it up without the VIN, the part was not available from his source, but on backorder. If I had the correct part number, I might be able to find it. Thanks again, Rich