Front Spring Removal - As I thought, simple without special compressor - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Diesel911 · #31 07-18-2014, 08:57 PM

I was hoping that People would have some further comments on the Method used in this thread to compress the Springs.

vtmbz · #32 07-18-2014, 09:53 PM

I pulled a front spring out of a w201 after the front strut was removed. Whatever else needed removing to get the lca free to swing we removed. I put a chain around the spring "just in case". put a crowbar down the center, tied a tifor griphoist to it and stood far enough away to feel safe. We just yanked it free.

My sense from that experience is that this thread is probably correct. I liked having the chain to contain things but it didn't jump far with the bar inside. I had a truck garage reinstall the spring in another vehicle-- from the look of those boys I bet they just squeezed it between their gums.

I also can easily imagine a doofus hurting himself if he tries to cut corners. But lets be frank -- a doofus can always hurt himself.....

vstech · #33 07-18-2014, 11:20 PM

I have wondered if this would work.

I have a 126 sitting in my yard nearly ready for scrapyard... I think I'll try lifting the car off the springs... Video and pics to follow...

clacker · #34 07-19-2014, 01:30 AM

It is very easy to remove the springs with lifting on the 123 and 126, done both recently front and back. The key is to remove the entire front control arm, it does not swing enough out of the way there is still tension-not enough to cause damage after 30 years on the springs, but new springs would have more tension. The rears come out very easily, just undo the shock at the top and unbolt the rear subframe, jack it up. Getting them back in would be tricky lining up bolts and jacking the control arm back up-not impossible but harder. I don't use a coil spring compressor at all, mine wore out a long time ago and is no longer safe. I would not remove springs this way with a hoist, it could be a problem trying to support the control arm while on the hoist and really stress one side/end and unbalance the car on the hoist.
Anyways, when stripping down a car few tools are needed, just undo and remove the weight and they are easily removed.

Diesel911 · #35 07-19-2014, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clacker

It is very easy to remove the springs with lifting on the 123 and 126, done both recently front and back. The key is to remove the entire front control arm, it does not swing enough out of the way there is still tension-not enough to cause damage after 30 years on the springs, but new springs would have more tension. The rears come out very easily, just undo the shock at the top and unbolt the rear subframe, jack it up. Getting them back in would be tricky lining up bolts and jacking the control arm back up-not impossible but harder. I don't use a coil spring compressor at all, mine wore out a long time ago and is no longer safe. I would not remove springs this way with a hoist, it could be a problem trying to support the control arm while on the hoist and really stress one side/end and unbalance the car on the hoist.
Anyways, when stripping down a car few tools are needed, just undo and remove the weight and they are easily removed.

What I got from this old thread is that it was not about using no Spring Compressor at all.

It was about using a commonly available Spring Compressor to hold the Front Spring where it is already compressed (when there is Vehicle Weight on the Spring) and or to Crank the Spring Compressor to compress the Spring just a bit instead of trying to use it to fully compress the Spring.

Diesel911 · #36 07-19-2014, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vtmbz

I pulled a front spring out of a w201 after the front strut was removed. Whatever else needed removing to get the lca free to swing we removed. I put a chain around the spring "just in case". put a crowbar down the center, tied a tifor griphoist to it and stood far enough away to feel safe. We just yanked it free.

My sense from that experience is that this thread is probably correct. I liked having the chain to contain things but it didn't jump far with the bar inside. I had a truck garage reinstall the spring in another vehicle-- from the look of those boys I bet they just squeezed it between their gums.

I also can easily imagine a doofus hurting himself if he tries to cut corners. But lets be frank -- a doofus can always hurt himself.....

I think we all have been the Doofus at one time or another.

But, keep in mind that if you do what is in the Thread the Spring is actually compressed way less than it would be if you compressed the Spring enough to remove it in the normal manner. You would think that if the Spring is compressed less the hazard is also reduced.

Like a lot of the stuff suggested in the various Threads each Person has to decide if what is suggested is workable for them.

If nothing else it is a good idea to keep this thread in mind if you are stuck someplace and you need to do an emergency fix.

Stretch · #37 07-19-2014, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

I was hoping that People would have some further comments on the Method used in this thread to compress the Springs.

Well I've been there and done it and I think it is a really dangerous tricky thing to do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIGRED

Months ago I brought up a concept. To remove the front springs, without using a compressor, by lifting the car off the spring.

Well I had some fool around time in the last couple of days and it was in the end simple. I did this on a 126. I went very slow and checked and double checked each action. I wanted to learn as well as pull the spring. While I spent several hours pulling my first spring. I am sure I can pull it start to finish in 30 minutes.

1. I raised the front end and supported the body with jack stands
2. Using a floor jack near the lower ball joint, I lifted the car just a bit more than jack stands.
3. I removed the wheel, shock, upper control arm and the brake hose.
3. I very slowly lowered the floor jack. I found that the guide rod was adding support and therefore holding the wheel up a bit. Being the spring is about 19 inches and at this point 17 inches was already released, I was not to worried about the amount of tension left, however I clamped on a pair of coil spring compressors (that cost about $10.00 at Harbor Freight) for added safety and shoved a breaker bar through the top opening of the spring (via the engine compartment). I found the last steps a bit over kill but safe.
4. Stepped on the front control arm, which pushed it down about 2" and then using a pry bar, popped out the spring.

When I removed the clamps, I measured 1" to 1 1/2" of compression, I don't think enough to cause any danger, but they added some control and peace of mind.

On the next wheel I am going to pull off the guide rod (bearing support) before lowering the wheel. My guess is that the spring will fall out.

Don

I don't recommend doing this ^^^

It is worth noting the following

1) The length of the front springs in the W123 / W126 chassis are not all equal - some are longer than others (see FSM)
2) The length of the spring is "made longer" by the spring pads fitted above
3) The dish that holds the bottom of the spring in place is only held on by three M8 bolts
4) The dish at the bottom of the spring "falls" at an angle in such a way that only one side of the bottom of the spring is being held in place - this isn't so unusual but there is often one heck of a lot of tension in the spring when it gets to this stage - there seems to me to be enough tension to wipe out your goolies - especially if you happen to have an unfortunate combination of a long spring and a thick spring pad
5) The brake stay also stops the lower control arm from dropping
6) The inboard eccentric bolts on the LCA also stop the LCA from dropping - especially if you have relatively new bushes.

I tried this approach to spring removal when I first got my W123 and I nearly **** my pants - it was not a nice experience. I do not recommend it.

I tried this approach with the front springs on my W201 (because they look so small and light weight) and it is a lot more do-able than the W123 ones - but still an internal spring compressor is best.

I will also add that unless you are just pulling these cars to pieces you need to have an internal spring compressor even for the light weight rear springs on either the W123 or the W201 if you want to put springs back in

compress ignite · #38 07-19-2014, 04:34 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oMfOtQTmAE

or here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RizBe-Vrwbg

or here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VebrcoHv3cM

BUT X 2 what stretch said.

Mxfrank · #39 07-19-2014, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

I was hoping that People would have some further comments on the Method used in this thread to compress the Springs.

Cheap hands, cheap tools.

Diesel911 · #40 07-19-2014, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by compress ignite

Mercedes Benz E Class Production Sindelfingen - YouTube

or here:

Mercedes E-Class Production, Sindelfingen, 2013 - Part 1 - YouTube

or here:

Mercedes E-Class Production, Sindelfingen, 2013 - Part 2 - YouTube

BUT X 2 what stretch said.

I went by the text of the guy that started the thread as My dial up Internet takes too long for me to watch Vids in a reasonabel time.

I have an Surgery coming up next week so I am not going to do it in the near future but I need to replace a torn Lower Ball Joint Boot or the Joint itself and I have the Strut type Spring Compressores from Harbor Freight.

When I have time I will try it and come back and post on this thread.

Stretch · #41 07-19-2014, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

I went by the text of the guy that started the thread as My dial up Internet takes too long for me to watch Vids in a reasonabel time.

I have an Surgery coming up next week so I am not going to do it in the near future but I need to replace a torn Lower Ball Joint Boot or the Joint itself and I have the Strut type Spring Compressores from Harbor Freight.

When I have time I will try it and come back and post on this thread.

Seeing as you have a surgery booked perhaps it is best to do the spring before hand so if something goes wrong the doctors are ready!

Diesel911 · #42 07-19-2014, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch

Seeing as you have a surgery booked perhaps it is best to do the spring before hand so if something goes wrong the doctors are ready!

I removed the both Springs with the Harbor Freight Strut Type Spring Compressor the First time I replaced the Lower Control Arm Bushings and reinstalled the same without bending them.

That worked becasue I did the tedious job of only turning the nuts 2 or so turns and bening careful not to tighten one side much more than the other.

When I did it the next time it was also working OK till I screwd up by pulling on one of the threaded Rods and that slide the Spring Compressor out of alighment with the one on the other side and bent the threaded Rods on both.

Like I said everyone can be a doofus; especially if you rush yourself. That is also what makes it a bad time to do the job before the Surgery because I would be part of My attention/focus would be on trying not to make My Hernia worse; increasing My chance for making a mistake.

In both cases I compressed the Springs as far as was needed to get them loose enough to pull them out.
The Method I remember from the old thread calls for minimum compression of the Spring.

Not related to compressing Spring but related to avoiding Bodily Injury. I was in a Car Accident caused by the other Driver where I had 5 breaks spread over 3 Ribs and My Lung on that side partially collapsed because one of the Ribs polkaed a Hole in one of the lobes of that Lung.

If I did what was safest for Me I would never get in a Car again!

Diesel911 · #43 07-19-2014, 11:34 PM

Well apparently My Memory of what I did 6 Years ago is Faulty.

From the old thread I must have bent the Spring Compressor by yanking on it on My first attempt to pull of the Springs.

I do remember that after the bending I replaced the 1/2" threaded Rod with 5/8" threaded rod and apprantly that is what I finished the job with.

"The only problem I have had is I am using a generic spring compressor (has hooks that hook from the outside). When the spring was compressed I decided to grab on of the compressors any yank the spring out.
This was a bad idea (I should have known better). It pulled the comressor 45 degrees from where it was supposed to be and the spring tension bent the threaded rod on the compressor.
Quote from the Thread July 2008
"I decided that I would just buy a new set but 2 Harbor Freight stores were out of stock. So I replaced the threaded rod on both compressors. I will be using it by the end of the day but will be more careful."

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/228951-unexpected-trouble-removing-front-lower-control-arm-bushings.html

Mxfrank · #44 07-20-2014, 12:34 AM

You don't need to remove the springs at all to to a ball joint boot. Jack up the car from the chassis. Place a second jack under the ball joint. Undo the strut. Use the second jack to lower the control arm just enough to remove the strut. Replace the boot.

If you can't afford a Klann-style compressor, why not just rent from one of the generous folks on the list?

Diesel911 · #45 07-21-2014, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxfrank

You don't need to remove the springs at all to to a ball joint boot. Jack up the car from the chassis. Place a second jack under the ball joint. Undo the strut. Use the second jack to lower the control arm just enough to remove the strut. Replace the boot.

If you can't afford a Klann-style compressor, why not just rent from one of the generous folks on the list?

I know it just seem like a good opportunity to test the idea.

With the Ball Joint disconnected from the Steering Knuckle you can get the max flex on the lower Control Arm to move it away from the partially compressed Spring.