cowardly, but I guess that goes well with doing nothing. You don't treat other people with respect when talking to them, don't expect respect back, seems you shouldn't have so much trouble understanding that. You seem like a smart guy, and on other subjects we have agreed many times, but even a smart guy could do well to learn some manners. Why not try?

CT does have some of the toughest gun laws in the country, id be happy if they are tougher.

I quoted the first section sure, the rest was more obnoxious attacking and doing nothing.

I have read their ideas, and no, I don't think a police state is a good idea, sorry. Other of their points I agree with.

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Apparently, you confuse me with your mother. She'll be all kind and nice and warm to you at all times, even when you're wrong.

I call you on your BS and you don't like it. I understand that, but don't confuse my attack on your fallacies with being obnoxious.

So, you'd be happy if the CT gun laws were tougher. Now, exactly how tough to they need to be before an individual such as Lanza is prevented from getting his hands on an illegal gun or a rifle or a shotgun? I'm assuming you will not attempt to ban rifles and shotguns, correct? If you can satisfactorily answer this one point, I'll have a bit more respect for you...........

I never suggested doing "nothing". Again, another failure to read on your part. I stand by the position that attempting to tighten existing gun laws will have absolutely no effect on the random violence perpetrated against an assembled group of sitting ducks.

They didn't suggest a "police state". They suggested that four or five teachers could be trained to use a firearm and said firearms could be at a readily available locked point in the school. This would take the folks in the school out of the "sitting duck" category. If publicized, it would also cause the DB a bit of pause before he tried to attack such a facility.

Actually I don't agree with that. The guns should be on their person at all times.

I think that is likely correct.

- Peter.

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2021 Chevrolet Spark
Formerly...
2000 GMC Sonoma
1981 240D 4spd stick. 347000 miles. Deceased Feb 14 2021
2002 Kia Rio. Worst crap on four wheels
1981 240D 4spd stick. 389000 miles.
1984 123 200
1979 116 280S
1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1971 108 280S

That presents a much greater problem for the individual teacher on a daily basis. A problem that most won't want to accept. If you could get four or five to accept the burden of carrying the weapon every single day, I'd say fine.

Putting them in locked storage boxes where only a select few have the key would be a better solution, although admittedly not quite as expeditious when and if needed.

Yes it does but then this is not a lightweight issue.

That's the problem. Unless you have on on your person it's useless in a situation we are discussing. It would be like having police officers leave their guns in the car until they go and check out the situation and figure out if they need them or not. Ludicrous.

I used to carry a pistol on me for years before I left SA. It's no big deal frankly assuming you are responsible about it. The problem would be in finding the responsible people, and agreeing on weapon type and carrying method.

But then of course I'm sure there would still be such an outcry from much of the public that it could never happen anyway.

- Peter.

__________________
2021 Chevrolet Spark
Formerly...
2000 GMC Sonoma
1981 240D 4spd stick. 347000 miles. Deceased Feb 14 2021
2002 Kia Rio. Worst crap on four wheels
1981 240D 4spd stick. 389000 miles.
1984 123 200
1979 116 280S
1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1971 108 280S

Not quite ludicrous.

It might take one minute to get to the lockbox and retrieve the weapon. That's sufficient time to save some folks.

Is it preferential to keeping a weapon on a person? Of course not. But, it might be a decent alternative for those who would revolt if they found out their teacher had a weapon on them while their kids were in class.

You cannot compare yourself to the average teacher or parent, sorry.

I've worked this weekend with one of the most lethal guys in the country for his training DVD I shot for him. He trains the navy seals, CIA operatives, UFC fighters and such, he can kill or disarm any person before they even know he was there, armed or not doesn't make a difference. During the making of the DVD we had 20 different fighters most of them masters in multiple martial arts, some of them world champion fighters. Even those highly skilled and trained fighters were put off guard and confused by his speed, skill and presence of lethal force.

Do you really think a teacher can find the composter to find the keys, unlock the save when all this unexpected violence is going on around him or her and then on top of it aim at the gun man. The body shuts down when something like this happens and not many can recover fast enough to make a difference. Even highly trained individuals need time to get back in the grove, I've seen it this weekend.

And schools get burglarized all the time, I'm sure it will be even worse when there are guns to grab.

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1979 Black on Black, 300CD (sold), 1990 Black 300SE, Silver 1989 Volvo 780, 1988 300CE (vanished by the hands of a girlfriend), 1992 300CE (Rescue).

I have been beaten up by angry teachers, man am I happy they didn't carry a gun. Like teachers don't have mental breakdowns.

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1979 Black on Black, 300CD (sold), 1990 Black 300SE, Silver 1989 Volvo 780, 1988 300CE (vanished by the hands of a girlfriend), 1992 300CE (Rescue).

Same with cops, right?

Basically, they are human after all. But you might hope cops are trained well; doubt teachers have time for that with their ever increasing work load.

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1979 Black on Black, 300CD (sold), 1990 Black 300SE, Silver 1989 Volvo 780, 1988 300CE (vanished by the hands of a girlfriend), 1992 300CE (Rescue).

Precisely. It would be easier to teach the MPs the federal curriculum.

I wonder what the homicide rate is for cops. Is it higher or lower than the populace? I don't know but I'll give it a look.

-----------------

Got it! http://www.policemisconduct.net/2010-npmsrp-police-misconduct-statistical-report/#_Excessive_Force

5.0 per 100k for the general population.
5.5 per 100k in the LEO population.

look, I understand you are mad as hell, and like to spew your vitriol on the internet and so on. Thats fine. However, I think you could learn some manners in discussion, you remind me of a bratty kid with your pissyness, and if you want, id be happy to spank you, feed you, or burp you, just let me know. Maybe you just need a kiss?

I haven't said any BS, im not sure where you read that in my original post, but apparently you can't actually discuss without spitting up, which is a shame.

Correct, I believe that arming teachers, police and military style schools setups, armored desks, high capacity weapons for certain teachers, ect, are all steps towards a police state, and steps from actually educating these kids.

I would be happy with no handguns, and no automatic or semiautomatic rifles available. Shotguns I don't have much problem with, and yes, he could certainly kill plenty of people with a shotgun, but I doubt the sheer number he murdered in this circumstance, which would be an improvement of some kind at least?

Yes, you pointed out that you think that tightening gun laws would have no effect on the possibility of these types of massacres, and if you read my post originally, you would find that I agreed with that and said that I would expect any effect of gun legislation to be multiple generations from now.
The point is, something needs to be done of some kind, and those are my opinions. You don't agree, fine, but act like an adult and respond accordingly for once.

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Like I said, your mother is the one to coddle you, not I. Apparently, you're unable to take a good discussion without getting your feelings all hurt............your mother will help you with that.

If you really believe that I'm the mad internet hatter with no manners, you've really grown up in the dark. I've simply pointed out the errors in your ridiculous assertions which you continue to make.

So, you admit that he could kill plenty of people with a shotgun, but you assert that the number would have been reduced? You make two assumptions here:

1) That he cannot get an illegal handgun or semi-automatic rifle.

2) That he doesn't spend additional time in the facility killing people. AFAIK, he only spent about three minutes. He had a good ten minutes.

I conclude that your argument for a reduced body count due to the shotgun is weak, at best. You absolutely fail to reduce the number of incidents. You simply attempt to reduce the number of casualties. This fails to effectively solve the underlying problem.

Now, in your last paragraph, you reverse yourself and agree that tightening gun laws would not have any effect.

So, on the one hand, you want to tighten gun laws...........and on the opposite hand you agree that they won't have an effect, but you must do something so that's what you'll do.

Sorry, but I refer back to the original statements regarding what reactionary people will do when "something needs to be done of some kind".

see? even you can actually be more polite when you care to try, thankyou.

Yes, my point about seeing no effect in gun control for several generations has to do with the saturation of weapons in this country, not a form of hypocrisy, try and understand that.

Unless you broke down the door of every single persons home and searched out every hidden weapon, you would never get them all. My own grandmother at 90+ has no less than 4 totally unregistered firearms in her home, 3 from WW2, and one from the 19th century, some kind of scatter gun. And we are not a big gun owning family, though I have owned 3 or 4 black powder guns over the years.

My point with this is that there needs to be time for available guns to become scarcer, to fall into disrepair, to be collected, ect. I think that process would take several generations. That 100 year old scatter gun has been leaning against the wall in an attic the entire time, remnant of the farm the house originally was, and according to my grandmother, she fired it as recently as 1970.

However, even a blanket law of some kind WOULD make a difference in the firearm murders in the country, even if its eventually.

If all handguns were outlawed and required to be turned in, what about that 2 3rds of women killed by angry husbands during domestic disputes that would be less likely to be shot in a fit of passion?

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