Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 12-30-2006, 04:25 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8
Well, I couldn't wait till Monday, so I got up early and started in. Regarding the test from the fuel tank, I applied vacuum to the plastic filter that comes from the tank, fuel flowed easily. I disconnected the spin on filter assembly and did not find any obstruction. Cleaned it and put it back on. Bled system and engine started. I have no idea at this point what the cause of the obstruction was. I drove it in to work, 32 miles, and I'll see what happens after it sits for 10 hours. I did bring all my tools with me just in case. I don't think the wife wants a call late at night to come pick me up. Thanks for all your help. By the way, what would be the best additive for the ULSD to keep my baby running? Any suggestions?

Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-30-2006, 09:45 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Flowood Mississippi
Posts: 438
Strange fuel stoppage....

My mistake...I see now.....you had the vacuum pump hooked to the (output) of the filter...using the mighty-vac like it was the lift pump....... you were pulling the vacuum through the clear plastic filter from the fuel tank...That is a good test.......my apologies....
Could be that there is sediment that will slowly clog the screen in the tank as long as fuel is being pulled from the tank....when the suction is removed from the screen when the engine is shut off...it will slowly fall off the screen over a period of time and partial normal flow will resume...until next time...
I had this happening on a 2001 Saturn Station Wagon...almost drove me crazy......cleaned the tank and changed fuel pickup screen and all was fine....
On the 123 series the fuel screen is easy to get to under the car....yours should be similar...If you drain the tank you can look down inside to see its condition by removing the fuel sending unit easily and inspecting with a good flashlight......kevin
__________________
1978 Yellow 300D (The Mustard Toad)
1980 Blue 240D (The Iron Toad)
1989 Grey Mitsu.4WD Mighty Max Pickup (Needs a Diesel transplant bad)

(Open the pod bay doors HAL)
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-30-2006, 09:56 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Flowood Mississippi
Posts: 438
Diesel Additive

The Bosch IP shop here uses Stanadyne for fuel system maintenance....There are a lot of additives out there and I have used several....I use about 50% homemade biodiesel so that takes care of the lube properties but I have heard a lot of good about Lucas upper cylinder lubricant added to the fuel for lube and injection system cleaning purposes....If you have a sediment problem in the tank, no additive will take care of that unless it is soluble like a gum or varnish.... I think the stanadyne and diesel purge may be very similar....they both smell exactly alike....I think the stanadyne is a little less costly.....On my old 240D...anything I dump in the tank burns without complaint...Engine runs the same.....only thing I notice is a difference in the exhaust smell....
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-30-2006, 10:05 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8
Thanks alot for all the input, I've been kicking around the idea of making biodiesel, didn't realize it would help out with the ULSD. When I first got my car, I did have an algae problem that took many filters to clean with eveything I was putting in the tank to clean it up. I finally puchased the fuel conditioner kit which finally cleaned up the tank, I also changed the tank screen at that time. Haven't had any sediment or algae problems since then. Like I said, I have no idea what happened, but this forum seemed to help out. If there was an obstuction, which I'm sure there was, I must have missed it when I pulled out the filter unit. Fortunately, all the help here saved me $$$$, towing fees, diagnostic fees, and who knows what else...
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-30-2006, 10:21 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Flowood Mississippi
Posts: 438
Fuel Flow

I have been lucky with the fuel systems on my two ....I heard but have not conformed that just 5% biodiesel added to the new diesel returns the lube properties to the old diesel levels......I get free used high quality cooking oil and it is so easy and fun to make the biodiesel that I run.... anywhere from 50% to 100% in the summer......I am going to put on a big Caterpillar fuel/water separator just for peace of mind anyway....
Keep a can of that canned air with you and if yours does it again...just disconnect from the clear filter and blow back to the tank to see if that clears the screen....
Barry1234 has good advice about removing the fuel cap before blowing the line.....
__________________
1978 Yellow 300D (The Mustard Toad)
1980 Blue 240D (The Iron Toad)
1989 Grey Mitsu.4WD Mighty Max Pickup (Needs a Diesel transplant bad)

(Open the pod bay doors HAL)
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-30-2006, 11:02 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
Posts: 6,510
If you had posted your location it might have helped. It might be getting cool enough to gell your fuel in the lines overnight. That is if you are in an area with the right temperature spread. If you suspect that is it just buy an additive to decrease flow or buy and add some kerosene. I love spending other peoples money. Remember it was running well when you parked it that evening. Temperature probably dropped off overnight somewhat. You may get a replay at work so I hope this note reaches you. Now comes the hard part where you inform me you reside in florida. Just a thought probably wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 12-31-2006, 08:19 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8
I'm actually in Los Angeles, I think the coldest it's been where I'm at is the low 40's. Not a freezing temp, but I didn't seem to have this problem last year. Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:00 PM
Registered Hack
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,617
lift pump testing

Kevin,

Is there any reasonable way to test the lift pump off the car?

I have two similar pumps, but the one on the right requires almost 2x the force to depress the roller than the one on the left.


any ideas?

The better one will go on my vehicle.
Attached Thumbnails
IP Problem??-pump-026.jpg   IP Problem??-pump-027.jpg   IP Problem??-pump-030.jpg  
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:49 PM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 30,034
Quote:
Originally Posted by jt20 View Post
Kevin,

Is there any reasonable way to test the lift pump off the car?

I have two similar pumps, but the one on the right requires almost 2x the force to depress the roller than the one on the left.


any ideas?

The better one will go on my vehicle.
There is no easy way to test the Lift Pumps by hand; and it would only verify that it pumps Fuel not the pressure it was able to reach.

You could remove the Big Plug in the center of the Pump as the Spring is under there and see if any of the Coils are broken; but it is rare for that to happen. (Be careful as with out Copper or Aluminum Jaws on your vice the pump wants to slip out; and the little drilled Flange Ears are easy to break to.)
The other thing that can go wrong is that the Springs for the Plastic Valves can sometimes rust in two if water has gotton inside and it has sat there for a long time.
But, in the end it is easier to put a Pump on the IP and try it.
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-07-2009, 09:27 PM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Being hard to press can mean either the pump is damaged or the spring is strong and healthy.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 05-07-2009, 09:27 PM
Registered Hack
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,617
Quote:
Originally Posted by vox incognita
Delivery end pressure of om615,616,617 lift pumps FP/K 22 M 13..14...101; FP/K 22MW 3...7
-with the fuel return line pinched:
-at idle speed, 1.1bar minimum
-at 3000 rpm, 1.3 bar minimum
Vacuum,measured before lift pump,idle speed-0.1bar min.


om621 FP/K22 M7(with spring 2 444 617 010)
Delivery measured between the IP and fuel main filter-0.8...1.5bar and 2.2 @ 3000 rpm.
Discharge end pressure of lift pump -min 2.5bar at 3000rpm.
Vacuum prior to lift pump inlet,idle speed-0.3-0.4bar min.
Pes4M, 5mm. plunger diameter,by-pass valve same as on w115,w123`s,1mm throttle hole in fuel return union bolt.


In another thread Mr.Whunter posted some info about lift pump rep.kits:


OM617.912 Lift pump Repair kit
Spring
0000910619=Bosch 2 444 616 010
This spring is also used in w115 and early w123 `s.Also in FP/K22MW3(w115 om617.910)

OM617.951 and OM617.952 Lift pump Repair kit
spring
0009934801=Bosch 2 444 617 010(WSF2156S8x)
This one is used in FP/K 22M7 in w110 621`s and some very early w115`s.

FP/K22 MW7(0 440 017 006) used "kolbenfeder fur 1 bar"
This was used from 07.76 to 08.97 on w123 300D and w123 240D`s
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...ten/mf1355.pdf

Here is a list of MB lift pumps with info as to what spring was used:

http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...en/0440017.pdf

0 440 017 023=FP/K22MW21 used 1bar spring

300D turbo;
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...ten/mf1357.pdf
FP/K22MW22=0 440 017 022 used 2.5 bar spring

In short,there is a great chance all om616 LP`s used the weaker spring.



FP/K22M5----M13 (w110,w115)
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...75/0440007.pdf
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...ige/fpk22m.pdf


FP/K22M13
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/d...en/0440007.pdf

Info concerning w115:
..the lift pumps FP/K 22M 13=0 440 007 014 is said to be equipped with weaker springs(2 444 616 010)-"kolbenfeder schwaecher", as opposed to the "standard" 2 444 617 010 one( .pdf`s above).

Anyway,I assume 2 444 616 010 spring is the weak one and 2 444 617 010 is the stronger one...but there might have been more than these two installed,who knows...

To see what Bosch equipment your car came with,to compare numbers etc. see:
http://www.automotive-tradition.de/e.../recherche.htm
...can be really tiresome,the quality of .pdf`s is far from good...
I think I found the reason for the difference in force.

one is clearly fp/k22MW21 from the 617.912

while the other is " " MW22 from the 617.952. Which correctly identifies my sources. No need to test then, since I have a .952

__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page