First I have read just about every thread on this subject, so I know there are folks out there who would never do this. This has been a BRUTAL summer in South Texas and lots of other locales. In 2004, I had my 1985 300SD converted to R134a at my favorite indy shop at that time due to a leak repair and the high price of R12. Well, it never was great at cooling after that, but adequate. This summer, I just could not deal with temps in the car. I was getting at best 55 to 65 degrees at the vent at 100º plus temps. I had started driving my V8 w208 which has very cold air as a daily driver. But I missed my SD. So...about a month ago, after doing tons of reading on the subject, I ordered two cans of "Enviro-Safe R134a Replacement Refrigerant with Dye" after being strongly discouraged by my present indy. He agreed to evacuate the R134 from my system, but told me he wouldn't work on my a/c again due to contamination. So I put the two small cans, 5 or 6 oz, in myself. I got a low pressure reading of about 30 from those two cans. On the way home, I was BLOWN AWAY. Vent temps began plummeting...(at about 95º outside) they fell to 45º on Auto fan speed after about a mile of driving. WOW! It got down to about 40º by the time I was home. Today, at around 11:30 with outside temp around 91º, I had a vent temp of about 35 DEGREES on low fan!!!! I wasn't running around with a vent thermometer when I had R12, but I don't ever remember it EVER being this cold. Maybe I made a mistake doing this, but it's an old car and it will die with me...not sure who'll go first. ONE OTHER THING...I can BARELY tell when the compressor comes on. I mean I push the a/c button and the idle speed barely changes. With R134, I could feel the hit of the compressor coming on. Just wanted to share my experience. Didn't think my old SD could ever have air this cold.

I'll stick with LP gas. Just have to fix my leak though!

__________________
1991 560 SEL / 185k miles
1992 750il / 17k miles - project car

How did you decide how much to use?

12 oz is 1/4 the R-12 capacity!

__________________

Current Mercedes
1979 maple yellow 240D 4-speed

Gone and fondly remembered:
1980 orient red 240D 4-speed

Gone and NOT fondly remembered:
1982 Chna Blue 300TD

Other car in the stable:
2013 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI / 6-speed MT

But I don't know the answer. I know little about a/c systems. I remember reading that each can equaled about a pound of R134a, even though the can was only 5 or 6 oz. It took the full amount of both cans and was still near the bottom of the blue zone of a cheap hose gauge. So I may be undercharged. I do plan to get another couple of cans, in case it gets banned.

That's interesting....I'm tempted to use the stop-leak version of this stuff.

__________________
14 E250 Bluetec "Sinclair", Palladium Silver on Black, 153k miles
06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 171k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
91 300D "Otis", Smoke Silver, 142k mi, wastegate conversion

19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
1961 Very Tolerant Wife

It's just propane.

__________________
Allen Kroliczek
Oak Grove Autosport | Oak Grove Autosport
01 G500, 82 300TD, quite a few more.....

And if you're amazed: http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=468525

__________________
Allen Kroliczek
Oak Grove Autosport | Oak Grove Autosport
01 G500, 82 300TD, quite a few more.....

it's NOT just propane...
it's propane/butane blend.

I'd not use the stop leak in any refrigeration system...

__________________
John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!

Dunno VStech, the MSDS for propane and Envir22a and propane are almost identical - down to 1/100 (0.01) for bp and specific gravity.

butane has a lower limit of flammability, higher specific gravity, and a much higher boiling point.

If there is any butane in there it is not enough to have an effect on the mixture than can be accurately measured. Those differences are just as likely to come from the pine scent they add.


EDIT: Just looked at the Duracool MSDS - I think THAT is likely to be a blend of propane and isobutane, based on the parameters listed above - each is intermediate between the MSDS specs for propane and butane.

It's funny though - the blend doesn't really alter the autoignition point (raises it from 873* to 891*) = which seems like the critical number!

__________________

Current Mercedes
1979 maple yellow 240D 4-speed

Gone and fondly remembered:
1980 orient red 240D 4-speed

Gone and NOT fondly remembered:
1982 Chna Blue 300TD

Other car in the stable:
2013 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI / 6-speed MT

I don't see the MSDS.

I saw some guy write down three parameters and a set of values.

If there's a link to the MSDS I'd like to see it.

From my investigations I believe it is a HC blend of propane-butane & some other component. Originally it was a pro/but blend but supposedly the DOT would not approve their 6 oz cans for shipping.

So the reformulated to a less efficient but acceptable to DOT. That's one of the reasons the refrigerant has such unusual and stringent installation procedures.

Cool! Literally. I'd like to know the high side pressures.

__________________
My occupational hazard bein'
my occupation's just not around...
1980 300SD
1980 300SD

High cost of R12?????????????? You mean the $15 a can for R12 as opposed to the almost $10 for R134a???????????

Unbelievable!

Enviro-safe MSDS: http://www.autorefrigerants.us/ESMSDS.htm

The rest are attached.....

Larry, I just went to AutoZone yesterday, and at least here in San Antonio, a 12oz can of R134a is $14.99 now.

Attached Files

	Duracool_12a_MATERIAL_SAFETY_DATA_SHEET_Cyl.pdf (25.5 KB, 137 views)
	n-but.pdf (110.5 KB, 127 views)
	propane.pdf (110.8 KB, 310 views)

__________________

Current Mercedes
1979 maple yellow 240D 4-speed

Gone and fondly remembered:
1980 orient red 240D 4-speed

Gone and NOT fondly remembered:
1982 Chna Blue 300TD

Other car in the stable:
2013 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI / 6-speed MT

I didn't know that R134a was that high now. I haven't bought any in quite awhile. I'm still working out of a couple of 30 pound cannisters.

I was at a local Farm & Ranch store yesterday and they had a BUNCH of it with a sign indicating $9.95 a can.

I don't even know what it costs today. And to everybody...I know this is NOT a solution for everyone. I am not that mechanically inclined. I did not want to pay to re-do my system for R12 again, whatever that entails. I just want to let you guys know how this stuff has worked for me. I waited a while before doing so, in case my compressor blew up or something. BTW...I got two cans of this stuff SHIPPED for around $15 bucks. The results were FAR above my expectations.