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  #1  
Old 05-06-2003, 11:58 AM
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Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Hockessin, DE
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anybody want to have a 190E M104 conversions

I saw the engine I was looking for 2 years ago. The 300SL M104 from 90-93. It uses the older Electro-Mechanical feul injection, so that you don't have to pay for a new engine management control system.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2413955695

The only other m104 alternative that still uses the older fuel management is the 300CE motor. The 300SL motor made about 230hp and 200 lb.ft. The 300CE makes about 215hp and 195 lb.ft. The 300CE motor is much more readily available, and with a chip, can be pushed to 235hp and 210 lb.ft.

Now most 300CE motors I've found have been around the $3k mark. Add the $500+ for the chip, and your at $3500.

I was also told though that the 300SL comes with anti-knock sensors and also is a lighter engine and what was used as the basis for the newer C280, E320, S320 and other inline 6 engines.

I'm not sure about the last statement.

But I am sure I almost bought that engine. I know, because I already bought the transmision to go with it. Its a 5-speed Getrage with front drive shaft, clutch, flywheel, pressure plate, flex disc, shift linkage, and more. I mean its everything needd for the conversion. It also matches right upto both motors. If anyone remembers Mike Skees witht he 300CE motor inside his 91 190E...he used a 300E tranny. Funny thing is, that a few 300SLs from 90-93 had the Getrag based Tranny matched to the motor in manual form. There were almost no changes from the 190E 2.3-16;2.5-16 Getrag trannys. These trannys were made to handle upto 400 lb.ft. torque. I know because Renntech said they never touched the transmision in the 300SL when it came to the manuals.

Now the reason I listed this as a 190E, is because I have everything for the 190E. The w124s prior to 93 could also get this drop in, but I beleive you would need to get the 300E 5-speed front drive half...not sure though. Don't quote me.

Either case, only thing you need is pateince to rewire this engine...and a cruise control and reverse relay (maybe $20 each...cheaper from a recycler) So that when you have the cruise on, and lift the clutch...the cruise will lift the gas, and reverse because...will reverse so the lights turn on when you shift into reverse.

I have the tranny, heres the motor. If anyone does purchase this motor and needs the tranny...Let me know. If I would have found this about 1 year ago...I would have had it in my car...but I now have a 99 M3, and have been toying with it. I can't really afford 2 project cars. So This is for anyone who wants a nice Conversion.

If you are a turbo person, be worn. I've heard that a few m104 engines can be easily adapted to accept the 98-99 E300 TurboDiesel manifold and turbo since they are very similar, both 24v DOHC engines, just built for each purpose...one a Gas engine, other Diesel. I'm not sure the truth of this rumor either, but so far it seemse feasible. If the manifold does bolt up, then all thats left is getting the turbo with it, or upgrading your turbo from something to match the m104 gas engine.

Good Luck, hope someone gets that engine.
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--------------------------------------------
- 03 Mercedes S600 Sport TTV12
- 97 Acura NSX-T
- 99 BMW E36 M3 w/500+ HP
- 04 Lexus RX330
- 04 Dodge Dakota Quad 4x4 V8

4 Sale:
- 99 BMW M3 E36 Coup with Dinan SC, Upgraded to an RMS Stage 3 with Aftercooler, 12psi, and 500+hp @ flywheel.
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  #2  
Old 05-06-2003, 04:15 PM
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So you have the necessary slave cylinder and pedal assembly also?

How much for the complete package?
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  #3  
Old 05-06-2003, 08:48 PM
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Yes I do

Although, let me double check to see If I can locate all the parts again. They are spereated over 3 boxes, and at a friends place thats a Benz Tech at the Dealer in Delaware. He was going to see if it would fit his C36...But didn't want to get involved with it because of the electronic drive by wire, and necessary computer changes.

I'll let you know once I gather everything. But I'd say about $1250 for everything (What he thought was a good price even, but Its not set in stone.)

Charlie.
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Chirag (Charlie) Patel
--------------------------------------------
- 03 Mercedes S600 Sport TTV12
- 97 Acura NSX-T
- 99 BMW E36 M3 w/500+ HP
- 04 Lexus RX330
- 04 Dodge Dakota Quad 4x4 V8

4 Sale:
- 99 BMW M3 E36 Coup with Dinan SC, Upgraded to an RMS Stage 3 with Aftercooler, 12psi, and 500+hp @ flywheel.
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  #4  
Old 05-06-2003, 10:51 PM
mbracer
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Quote:
Originally posted by 2phast
So you have the necessary slave cylinder and pedal assembly also?

How much for the complete package?
Rik,

Use a new slave cylinder. They are cheap and not worth the head ache if they go bad. I bought all new hydraulics whe I did my conversion. I also got rid of the rubber hose portion of the clutch line and had a custom stainless reinforced teflon line made. You should be able to have one made at a hose and rubber supplier.

Danny
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  #5  
Old 05-06-2003, 11:13 PM
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chiragp

OK, IM researchin the turbo route for the m103 2.6 motor in my 190E 2.6 5-SPEED. My goal is a 100HP increase over the 158HP stock setup. any advice ?
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  #6  
Old 05-06-2003, 11:41 PM
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sorry NA....ideas so far.

Sorry don't know much about the turbo route. I didn't really look at that route yet. However I can say I highly doubt the E300 TD manifold will bolt up to the m103 2.6.

That said, I planned for that engine, my tranny, and rear out for a 3.27. With the 5-speed, it should be a pretty nice match. Although power won't be as high as your turbo route...it would be pretty close to power (slightly taller) but the gears in the tranny are taller, so it should be about as quick as my M3 stock. Which is about 0-60 in about 5.2 on a great launch. More like 5.5 without much clutch abuse.

My plans for my m3 are a Dinan Vortech supercharger. Then lowering the compression slightly. Adding an intercooler/aftercooler. Maybe in the end, a purge system for the NOS directly into the intercooler.

As you can see, my garage is going to be selling many unused parts.
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Chirag (Charlie) Patel
--------------------------------------------
- 03 Mercedes S600 Sport TTV12
- 97 Acura NSX-T
- 99 BMW E36 M3 w/500+ HP
- 04 Lexus RX330
- 04 Dodge Dakota Quad 4x4 V8

4 Sale:
- 99 BMW M3 E36 Coup with Dinan SC, Upgraded to an RMS Stage 3 with Aftercooler, 12psi, and 500+hp @ flywheel.
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  #7  
Old 05-07-2003, 09:31 AM
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Charlie,

>It uses the older Electro-Mechanical feul injection, so that you don't have to pay for a new engine management control system.

Take care, the early M014 with 3000ccm still had the KE-Jetronic, but the control system is different from the M103. There must be something, that adjusts the cam shaft.
Putting this engine into an W201 or W124 will need some additional (electronic) components and "some" wireing too.

>The only other m104 alternative that still uses the older fuel management is the 300CE motor. The 300SL motor made about 230hp and 200 lb.ft. The 300CE makes about 215hp and 195 lb.ft. The 300CE motor is much more readily available, and with a chip, can be pushed to 235hp and 210 lb.ft.

The more hp for the R129 mostly comes from the larger exhaust.
What kind of chip are you thinking of? The KE is mostly mechanical, I don't know a way to chip this thing.

>I was also told though that the 300SL comes with anti-knock sensors and also is a lighter engine and what was used as the basis for the newer C280, E320, S320 and other inline 6 engines.

The M104 3000ccm was the first with anti-knock sensor.
It is an inline six vs. V6 in the cars since 1995 or so.

best regards,
bis denn,
Christian

1989 300TE
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  #8  
Old 05-07-2003, 10:46 AM
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Thanks

Yes Christian is correct. The engine/wiring part can all be done by Rick at RC-Imports. As Long as KE-J is there from the car to the engine, he can get around it he said.

The chip I was referring to was the one on the groupbuy. They have a chip for the 300CE.

I should have clairfied I only meant the inline 6 m104s, not the v6s. Think C280, E320, C36....not the later V6 powered vehicles.

People confuse this setup with the limited run of 190E 3.2-24v AMG cars. That used the 300SE motor if I'm not mistaken. This is the closest, most affordable route w/o going electronic managment.

Good Luck.
Charlie.
__________________
Chirag (Charlie) Patel
--------------------------------------------
- 03 Mercedes S600 Sport TTV12
- 97 Acura NSX-T
- 99 BMW E36 M3 w/500+ HP
- 04 Lexus RX330
- 04 Dodge Dakota Quad 4x4 V8

4 Sale:
- 99 BMW M3 E36 Coup with Dinan SC, Upgraded to an RMS Stage 3 with Aftercooler, 12psi, and 500+hp @ flywheel.
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  #9  
Old 05-07-2003, 04:58 PM
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Ok, so let me know on what you have, don't worry about the slave, will just get a new one like Dan suggested.

For the M104 Jetronic, the ECU and EZL are the two important items that need to be swapped over.

From what I have been told, the 300sl Ecu will plug into a 1992 or later wire harness.

As for the 190E AMG. These cars used a stroked M103 motor not the M104 motor. At least the official production run of AMG 190E 3.2l's did, of course its possible that some one-offs were built using the M104 motor.
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  #10  
Old 05-07-2003, 06:20 PM
mbracer
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Quote:
Originally posted by 2phast
Ok, so let me know on what you have, don't worry about the slave, will just get a new one like Dan suggested.

For the M104 Jetronic, the ECU and EZL are the two important items that need to be swapped over.

From what I have been told, the 300sl Ecu will plug into a 1992 or later wire harness.

As for the 190E AMG. These cars used a stroked M103 motor not the M104 motor. At least the official production run of AMG 190E 3.2l's did, of course its possible that some one-offs were built using the M104 motor.
I bought the slave cylinder from the benzbin. BTW Rik, is that the same 104 you were going to get last year?
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  #11  
Old 05-10-2003, 01:53 PM
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Not sure, looks like it, but the email is different. I scrapped that original idea as the motor I was looking at was stripped and the guy was trying to jack me on the shipping (negotiated that to a reasonable price) and then jack me on all the parts.

I fully expected to see a complete motor, not a stripped down one, plus he did not have the EZL or the ECU.

Still looking for a motor but $2900 is too much, wrecked 300CE's go for that price at the insurance auctions, I may just get one of those, pull what I need and sell the rest of the car to recoup my costs.

I am exploring other power options right now also, something that does not require a R&R of the motor.
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