^^^^^^^^^^

If/when I come to strangers door I knock and back way up- far enough for them to not be able to shoot me thru the door. It's also far enough for them if they look to see who I am and know that I cannot be a immediate threat. A threat in 2 seconds because that's how long it would take to rush the door? Yes about that much; at least that much- which means I better be at least 10 steps back. Better to be 20 steps back. If it's a old man with bad vision who's been mugged and robbed in his home he'll be more likely to be trigger happy- and it's MY RESPONSIBILITY to insure I don't create a confrontation in his or her mind.

Anyone who trespasses is liable to create a confrontation and it is solely their responsibility to insure that the person who's property they are trespassing onto understands that you pose no threat whatsoever.

I agree. When I knock on anyone's door, at anytime of day or night, I always back off the door, and stand where they can see my face and hands.

They most certainly bear the lion's share of the responsibility, but not all. The homeowner bears the responsibility to not over-react.
Also, AFAIK, there is no legal expectation of privacy on your walkway and at your front door, unless they are posted. Using them for their intended purpose does not constitute trespass.

On the other side of that coin, anyone who shoots someone bears the lion's share of ensuring that they are not shooting a non-threat. The shootee (if you will) bears the responsibility to convey that they are not a threat.


In the originally linked article, do you believe that the homeowner was legally justified in shooting the old man on his porch?

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On some nights I still believe that a car with the fuel gauge on empty can run about fifty more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. - HST

1983 300SD - 305000
1984 Toyota Landcruiser - 190000
1994 GMC Jimmy - 203000

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If your door is in NYC and it's three steps from the sidewalk maybe that's not trespassing. If it's not a city and your door is a hundred steps that perhaps is not trespassing; posted or not. Continue with the scenario- what if the door is a 1/4 mile from the country road thru a dense bush/hedge? Is that trespassing?
I don't know if that guy has had four B&E at his house in the last month- do you? How about his neighbors- have they had dozens of violent B&E's lately? Has the guy behind the door had his wife raped and killed by what first appeared to be a innocent person knocking at the door?
Or has he never had any of that happen and instead all that's come to his door is late night girl scouts selling cookies- of which he buys by the dozen? Has there been reports of a serial killer on the loose who claims to have had a car accident?

You don't know that by the article and no one does. This means you cannot climb inside the mind of the homeowner to say. Until I know more I refuse to pass judgment- but if you feel you can; and it appears you do- by all means do so.

Ask Honus- there are morons and violent people who are tricky and strong in this world. Some places are filled with them; streets, courthouses and backyards alike. It only takes a second to be fooled and lose a loved one forever.
If you are in a car accident and need help- do what it takes to get the attention of a homeowner in such a way that you are not met with force- bang on the door and go back to the street and yell that you have been in a car accident. Bang on four doors and do the same thing. I don't care or GAS, but don't blame the homeowner until you have better knowledge of the incident.

In addition, we must speculate on other scenarios because with media today each event touches others who then want to change laws which may or may not fit the same set of circumstances to which this incident has had. Mass marches take place and movements grow- out of one thing. Those movement then effect places and people who may or may not have the same thing happen. It's NOT confined to this one incident.

Gee whiz there MTU... no need to get surly.
I never suggested that my view was superior, never suggested that the guy was not justified either.
I did suggest that he should face charges (involuntary manslaughter).
Maybe a better option would be to send the case to a grand jury to determine if charges are warranted.
I do not believe that gunning down a person on your door step should be an acceptable practice that goes unquestioned by the criminal justice system.
This is your belief?

Let me rephrase the question.

Do you believe that there should be an investigation into whether the mans actions were justified?

If so, what factors could (in your mind) could make the shooting unjustified?



Even the FL version of stand-your-ground has a clause stating that the force was used to prevent bodily harm or the commission of a felony... and further states that in the case of home application, that the person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering, or had entered into the home.
Seems to me like it does not grant the right to blast someone on your doorstep.
I know of no place in this country where a private home/land owner is legally permitted to kill for trespass.
This seems to be what you are advocating...

__________________
On some nights I still believe that a car with the fuel gauge on empty can run about fifty more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. - HST

1983 300SD - 305000
1984 Toyota Landcruiser - 190000
1994 GMC Jimmy - 203000

https://media.giphy.com/media/X3nnss8PAj5aU/giphy.gif

Check out the laws in Texas.........and no, Texans aren't at band camp either....

IMHO, there are too many nut case whacked out homeowners out there. If it were me and I were physically able, I'd hike to the nearest business to ask for help before knocking on a homeowner's door, especially in the middle of the night.

Back in the old days, my great-grandfather said you'd sit on your horse outside of the house and holler. If there was no answer, walk your horse away and come back another day. A good policy for everybody. Moving it forward to todays conditions, when you come to my house unexpected, stand where I can clearly see you when you ring the doorbell. Don't wander around my yard, don't peek through my windows.

You're right, edited. My apologies.When one person is shot by another person and it's not in war time the LEO ought to come and try to find out what happened. I don't know in this case if a GJ is needed. I don't think it should be allowed that an individual can use lethal force which ends in death in all cases. Some, yes; some no.

The part I put in bold should be the standard operating procedure. If it isn't there's something wrong.

Grand jury? I'm mixed on that. Grand juries can be abused by prosecutors because they have very broad latitude. I hate star chambers in general, though I understand the GJ is a useful tool.

My very first encounter with the USA was when we got the horrible news that my dads best friend, a well known professor, was shot and killed when he knocked on a strangers door to ask for directions, 1974 Florida.

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1979 Black on Black, 300CD (sold), 1990 Black 300SE, Silver 1989 Volvo 780, 1988 300CE (vanished by the hands of a girlfriend), 1992 300CE (Rescue).

And yet you persist in remaining in this godforsaken land of murderous nuts.

This seems like an exaggeration to Me.
It is extremely seldom that the News Media reports the many times that Armed Citizens hold someone at Gun Point until the Police arrive. Becasue that is not considered News.
So you are not seeing any sort of balanced reporting of those who Shoot and those who do not shoot.
The unbalnced reporting of the News makes it appear that everytime this sort of situation happens someone shoots and kills someone.

I don't think the specific situation has been ignore because the SYG issue was brought up and that issue covers more territory than just this specific issue.
I am with the People who say the Matter should be investigated throughly and if there is grounds to prosecute the Shooter then that is what should be done.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel

The way I read it you comment was directed towards Alkims Comment and I Paraphrased what Alkim said.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel

No one should be charged unless some investigation of the evidencs supports a charge being filed.
The only reason I could see for filing a charge before some investigation has been done is if it was a repeated incident or the Police beleive the Guy might flee.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel

Yes, there is seldom a dull moment here. Perhaps some Peole stay because the want to see what is going to happen next; Morbid Curiosity.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel