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  #1  
Old 06-07-2001, 12:39 AM
Ali Al-Chalabi's Avatar
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I have read all the info on this board about changing the fluid in the tranny on a 97 C280.

However, the point that I cannot understand is that the dealer has repeatedly refused to change the fluid on the transmission.

They claim that all the break-in material is run out of the tranny at the factory and that the fluid will last as long as the transmission. They also say that the transmission is a sealed unit and they are unable to seal it like it is done at the factory and will leak. Why would it not be possible to replace the pan without it leaking? Are there no suspended particles floating around anywhere in the tranny? I'd get the special tool dipstick and do it myself, but if a reputable dealer can't reseal a transmission, then I sure wouldn't be able to do it either. Is there any truth to this?

Sorry for posting about something that has been repeatedly covered and thanks for any replies.

-Ali Al-Chalabi
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  #2  
Old 06-07-2001, 12:54 AM
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This is all false. The pan will seal just fine, the pan gasket and drain plug seals are available like any other MB transmission. How do they expect any repairs to be accomplished if the transmission can't be resealed? i have had several of these apart and no unusual problems with leaks. On a 97, there is still a drain plug on the torque converter, so this can be drained as well. The fluid for this transmission is a little pricey, so realize this. It isn't intended to be changed as a service item, but I can't imagine a dealer "refusing" to do this if you really want it done. There is also a trans filter available so this can be done also. The only thing different about doing this, as it sounds like you know, is the refill procedure, as the dipstick is a shop tool, and the ATF temp must be monitored to ensure the level is correct. Make sure they replace the cap lock also, as the tube cap isn't very secure (could come off) without the locking tab installed, and it is a one-time use lock.
Gilly
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  #3  
Old 06-07-2001, 01:09 AM
Ali Al-Chalabi's Avatar
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Thanks for the quick reply!

I didn't think that it made sense that the transmission can't be resealed properly. The car currently has 65k miles and I feel it would be good preventative maintenance if the car is be kept around for a long while.
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  #4  
Old 06-07-2001, 07:33 AM
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I agree. This is a tough transmission ans uses some pretty slick ATF, but a lifetime fill is still pushing it a bit. If you plan on keeping the car for several hundred thousand miles, this would be a good investment.
Gilly
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  #5  
Old 06-07-2001, 05:42 PM
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To Ali-----Is this dealership in Little Silver N.J. or in Freehold N.J.?
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  #6  
Old 06-07-2001, 08:14 PM
Ali Al-Chalabi's Avatar
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Dale-

In Little Silver, I am surpised that they refused, considering that they are an excellent dealer and service department.
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  #7  
Old 06-08-2001, 07:16 AM
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That surprises me too. As stated they are an EXCELLENT dealership....Hope all goes well with the fluid replacement.
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  #8  
Old 06-08-2001, 10:04 PM
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Blackmercedes

JS (sorry can't remember names that well)
Yes, there is a op code for trans fluid and filter, with a small caveat:
The code listed is for model designators (you probably won't recognize these types of designators) C1, C2 and C3. A C1 is a C220, which was made only with a 722.4 trans. A C2 is a C280 with the 104 motor, had either a 722.4 or .6 depending on year, and a C3 is a C36, also available with either the 722.4 or .6 depending on year. In the operation fiche, there is no differential noted between the type of transmission the car has. I tend to believe the intention was for the 722.4 transmission, but again, the model indicator "fits" either model (either transmission type). Like a dumass, I didn't look for the C230 like yours, though, so I will repost on Monday my findings. For some reason I thought you had a C280, not a 230. I like the naturally aspirated C230, nice running cars. The (warranty) labor time for this job is .8 hour on a C1, C2, C3 car.
Gilly
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  #9  
Old 06-09-2001, 12:58 AM
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Now that we're on this topic...

What's the difference between the fluid on the 722.4 transmission fluid and the 722.6 transmission fluid? I noticed that the trans fluid dipstick is sealed the same on my 1995 C280 and the newer MB's.

If the transmission fluid is the only difference between the operating of the 2 trans' then why couldn't you use the transmission fluid that's used in the 722.6, in the 722.4?
What mechanicality (not a word...) of the 2 transmissions makes the 722.6 transmisison 'capable' (to be tested) of a lifetime fluid, and not the 722.4 transmission, persue (sp) ?? I hope that makes sense.

In other words, if you were to use the "lifetime" (I wouldn't bet on it) transmission fluid in both the 722.4 and the 722.6, then why would it only be ok in the 722.6? Is there something special about the 5 spd 722.6 that makes it capable of a lifetime fluid as opposed to the 722.4?
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Previous:
1993 300E 3.2L Sedan w/ close to about 300k miles
2003 E500 Brilliant Silver (Had 217k miles when totalled!)
1989 300E with 289,000 miles (had for <1 yr while in HI)
03 CLK 500 cabrio (Mom's)
2006 C230k (Dad's)
1999 S420 (Mom's/Dad's)
2000 C230k Sport sedans
2001 CLK320 Cabrio (Mom's)
1995 C280 My First Mercedes-Benz... (155k miles. EXCEPTIONAL AUTOMOBILE. Was Very hard to let go of!)
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  #10  
Old 06-09-2001, 01:17 AM
David C Klasse's Avatar
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John,

So there is no dipstick? There is only the tube and then a locking device at the top? Interesting....
I noticed that the 722.4 and then 722.6 locking devices look very similar, both with lock on them. I just 'naturally' assumed there would be a dipstick! I heard there weren't dipsticks... but I noticed them on the newer ones (atleast what I thought was a dipstick).

I do understand that the 722.4 is a conventional trans while the 722.6 is electronic, BUT, how do they differ in mechanics for the diff fluid? I know they are controlled differently, but does that affect the mechanical operation of the two, thus different fluids for each trans?
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2006 E350 w/ 155k miles (Daily Driver)

Previous:
1993 300E 3.2L Sedan w/ close to about 300k miles
2003 E500 Brilliant Silver (Had 217k miles when totalled!)
1989 300E with 289,000 miles (had for <1 yr while in HI)
03 CLK 500 cabrio (Mom's)
2006 C230k (Dad's)
1999 S420 (Mom's/Dad's)
2000 C230k Sport sedans
2001 CLK320 Cabrio (Mom's)
1995 C280 My First Mercedes-Benz... (155k miles. EXCEPTIONAL AUTOMOBILE. Was Very hard to let go of!)
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  #11  
Old 06-09-2001, 01:46 AM
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David
The cap is locked on a 722.4 and .6 because Mercedes feels that the transmission must be fully HOT before analyzing the fluid level. On the 722.6, they left the stick out entirely because thay felt that if someone other than an MB shop checked it, that the incorrect fluid may be added, They are making it tougher for shops who shouldn't be messing with it,well, to mess with it. In general, they only want qualified mechanics to be in there. The lock on the 722.4 dipstick (yes, the 722.4 HAS a dipstick but the cap is locked) is way different than the tiny one on a 722.6 cap. The dipstick for a 722.6 is a MB tool. To do the level checking correctly the car is connected to SDS or HHT and the ATF temp is monitored using a temp sensor internal to the transmission. The MB tool dipstick is about 2 feet too long for the dipstick tube, it is inserted until it bottoms out. So you can't just buy the special tool dipstick and just leave it in place.
Many owners come in for service and the lock will be broken off on a 722.4. It's no big deal as the dipstick still has a "lock" that the orange colored lock is supposed to keep from being unlocked. On the 722.6 trans, it's a little more important to keep the lock in place, as the lock is the only thing that keeps the cap in place.
The 722.6 ATF question is a good one. I'm not sure. They alluded to the fluid being synthetic when I went to class on it, it's 10-15 bucks a quart, made by Deutsche Shell in Germany.
In answer to your question, I don't know if it is OK to put the 722.6 ATF in any other trans. It's pretty pricey to just try it.
Nor do I know if they feel the 722.6 is that much better of a tranny that it can use a lifetime fill of fluid, or if it's just a real "Super Fluid" that they do this. Probably a combination of the 2.
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  #12  
Old 07-08-2001, 04:53 PM
c36amg88
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C36 transmission

My C36 transmission just went out at 61k miles. I can't belive it either. I didn't even get a chance to change my tranny fluid! I was gona change it that week too.

Hopefully MBZ USA will help me out on this one.

Any advice on how to get this warrantee.

"HELP"
(the sad tired out C36 slowly crawls off to the shoulder lane for the first time, whispering home desperately holding on to its 1st gear)
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  #13  
Old 07-08-2001, 05:39 PM
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John's right. It really pays to support the local dealership. They "haf many vays" of helping you out. They may or may not help you out, it all depends. Alot of cases the decision can be made right there at the dealership in a case like this. There is a certain amount of "leeway" on what they can consider a warranty repair, the dealer is more or less "going out on a limb" for people when they authorize an out-of-warranty repair like this. They are more likely to "go out on a limb" for a good customer, rather than someone they only see coming in to the parts department to buy oil filters, then come in with the car on a wrecker with a shot transmission and "jiffy Lube" stickers on the windshield. Think about it.
Gilly
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  #14  
Old 07-08-2001, 10:54 PM
c36amg88
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Your inputs are much aprichated.
And I'm glad the dealer "haf many vays".

(indead)

Thank you
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  #15  
Old 07-29-2001, 03:39 PM
c36amg88
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Transmission 722.6 C36

Well I got my 97 C36 722.6 transmission rebuilt.

The shop told be the reason for my transmission needing rebuilding so early, is due to an over heating of the transmission fluid from being on the tracks. They said I burnt some bearings. They STRESS the need for my 722.6 transmission to have an additional transmission oil cooler.

Well. I took a look at the factory one, and it looks like in can handle the job.

-QUESTION for Gilly,
Do you agree that I should add an additonal trany oil cooler?
What is the color of the "life-time-fill" trany fluid?

I want to make sure the shop put in the nice expensive 722.6 trany fluid, and didn't go cheap on me by giveing me normal ATF, then force me to get an additional trany cooler.
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