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  #31  
Old 11-23-2002, 02:21 PM
1992300e
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Normal

As posted early on in the post. As stated manual, it's normal emissions control warm up delay.

Don't fix what aint broke.

You'll have plenty of other opportunities to fix stuff.

Joel
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  #32  
Old 11-23-2002, 11:03 PM
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Are we sure this is normal?

I keep hearing this is normal, but NONE of my other MBZ's do it this consistently.

I would agree it is normal if it didn't do this AFTER it was warm...but has this delay when it is hot enough to cook a meal on the engine.

I have talked to dealership and they feel it is not normal and want to replace the tranny, but the tranny has just been rebuilt.

Why would it change without a delay after the first, or now on these colder mornings the second 2 -3 upshift, but once I turn off the ignition for a shirt as 5 seconds it returns to the delay sequence even though the engine is HOT and doesn't need the warm up cycle.

On the other hand, if I switch off and then right back on, the delay is not present.

It just seems like there is some electrical delay that is kicking in over and above the designed delay when cold.

And yes, unfortunately there seems to be a whole range of additonal problems that need to be fixed as well. (but that's one reason why we love these cars...they keep us busy!)

Poll: Any other SL owners having this same weird 2 - 3 shift behaviour when warm?
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_______________
'90 300SL
'90 190E 2.6
'87 300TE (gone to car heaven)
'84 190D (passed along...still in the family and used on a daily basis)

Last edited by oldblue1; 11-23-2002 at 11:16 PM.
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  #33  
Old 11-24-2002, 06:51 AM
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For a 190e 2.6 it clearly states in the owners manual that it is normal for the delayed shift when the engine temp is below a cerain temp.

Of course the mechanic is going to wan't to replace the tranny$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
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  #34  
Old 11-24-2002, 11:13 AM
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Sorry to belabour this point, but my 190e 2.6 1990 doesn't do continue to do this, or even nearly approximate the way the SL is behaving, neither does the 300TE, nor does the 190D.
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'90 190E 2.6
'87 300TE (gone to car heaven)
'84 190D (passed along...still in the family and used on a daily basis)
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  #35  
Old 11-24-2002, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by oldblue1
Sorry to belabour this point, but my 190e 2.6 1990 doesn't do continue to do this, or even nearly approximate the way the SL is behaving, neither does the 300TE, nor does the 190D.
You are right. It should only do it on the first 2-3 shift when the car is cold.

I know someone suggested a rebuilt trans to you. The question becomes....is it the transmission that somehow knows the engine temp? Or does something outside the transmission tell the transmission to delay that shift?

If the signal comes from outside, rebuilding the trans would be pointless.

If the transmission itself makes the decision, I would imagine that only the valve body is involved...much less work than a complete rebuild.
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  #36  
Old 11-27-2002, 03:13 PM
1992300e
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did not realize

I did not realize the long shift has been speratic and happening when hot.

Sounds like you are probably onto it yourself.

I would think it maybe something to do with the unit that tells the computer when to hold shifts and when not to rather than the tranny it's self.

Joel
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  #37  
Old 11-27-2002, 04:00 PM
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Angry delayed shifts

I agree with tkd_M119 regarding what we should collectively expect from such a premier marque as Benz. For one, I would expect a smoothly changing gearbox(auto) at whatever temp or time of proceedings. From the first start in the morning or any time of day, it should move away smoothly, changing without any nasty jerks or kicks in the backsides. Throughout the whole trip, the auto should have been designed to operate consistently without fail or variations. When going uphill or downhill, the auto should have been designed to change into the correct gears by itself based on the angle of attack, the weight of the car, the weight of the passengers and cargo, and also the speed it is going at and the car's engine capacity and torgue. My C180 would simply creep uphill and won't change down until I have depressed the pedal down to the bottom for a few minutes before it changes down 1 gear which is not first gear, probably second. This isn't enough to tackle the steeper slopes. What can I do? Looks like I have to take this punishment or sell it!
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  #38  
Old 11-27-2002, 08:21 PM
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Testing transmission delay upshift sensors and electronics?

If it is not the tranny itself, which we seem to have ruled out based on the rebuild and the above discussion, how does one test the sensors and the controlling electronics to see if there is a problem with their operation?

I can see the little black delay upshift unit that is attached to the driver's side of the tranny. It has a single cable that comes up to the area under the air filter. (1990 300SL) ... and it is way on down there...I will need thin arms or have to get to it from underneath.

Many thanks...
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'90 190E 2.6
'87 300TE (gone to car heaven)
'84 190D (passed along...still in the family and used on a daily basis)
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  #39  
Old 11-28-2002, 11:29 AM
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Being that several of us have the same complaint I doubt it is the sensors. I'm sure it's inherent in the design of the transmissions somewhere along the line (weather it be electronic or mechanical).

It's just disappointingwhen you drive some crap domestic rental car and it shifts smoothly when cold. I think this is something MBZ has gotten away with because they are MBZ.
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  #40  
Old 11-29-2002, 07:08 AM
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Angry delayed shifts

For the kind of money that we have to cough out to get a Benz in some countries, we definitely expect to get something worth gold and not tin can. The exterior must be solid and graceful, the interior luxurious and well equipped, the engine quiet , powerful and smooth, the auto transmission quiet, smooth and doing the right things all the time without rude jerks which are more normal with manual shifting. However, some of the earlier Benzes were used in Europe for taxis and it probably didn't matter to the maker and designers whether the auto gave any hard jerks or not. After all what can you expect from a taxi??? However, we in other countries saw it in a different manner, to us the Benz is always a rich man's car. So we expected it to be perfect in all ways. I feel that the jerk in the 2nd to 3rd shift was a failure by designers to make a smooth gear change, thats all. It would have cost them too much to redo the gearbox and take too long, so let it go and cover it up as usual with some believable excuse like reducing emissions, so we heat up the Cat. by delaying the change for a few minutes. It that was true, why didn't any other maker "have" to do the same thing??? They all had Cats at that time, just cooler Cats. Also, even if the delay was really necessary, it could still have been designed to change smoothly instead of this rude bonk from behind??? Can anyone out there give an intelligent answer?
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  #41  
Old 11-29-2002, 08:11 AM
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audi's and beemers do the same thing...
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  #42  
Old 11-29-2002, 12:16 PM
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Maybe it's just a German attitude problem?
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  #43  
Old 11-29-2002, 02:10 PM
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Audi's and Beamer's do they same

Is this then a unique German design idea? What about Porshe?

I don't remember this being a problem or even an issue on any of my previous Beamers!

So, this goes back to the question, what can we do about this? Is there a way to defeat this, or test that it is working properly on the SL?
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_______________
'90 300SL
'90 190E 2.6
'87 300TE (gone to car heaven)
'84 190D (passed along...still in the family and used on a daily basis)

Last edited by oldblue1; 11-29-2002 at 06:24 PM.
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  #44  
Old 11-29-2002, 06:12 PM
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Unhappy delayed shifts

Unfortunately they say its "NORMAL", so thats the sort of thing you have to cope with if you want to keep the car. They would have been more popular if they didn't have this glitch and sold a lot more cars all over the world. If they admitted a design flaw or manufacturing flaw, they would have been inundated with claims for compensation or refunds for a basically flawed car. They also had many other issues which had to be fixed like the leaking head gaskets, burnt out wiring harness, the dodgy speedo, the dodgy rev counter, the dash lights that burn out so quickly, the aircon/heating problems and so on and so forth. I still want to keep my Benz only for the style of driving one, people look at you and wonder!!! He's rich, maybe a drug dealer or a vice king!!! The build quality is much better than so many other brands and you feel really safe driving one. Thats my lot anyway. Today its going in for a check on the rearheadrest jamming, the vacuum buzzing sound, the lack of power, muffler too noisy and pinging.
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  #45  
Old 11-29-2002, 09:39 PM
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This is odd every E320 (W124) that I drove in the past few months (test drives) didn't do this and shifts so much smoother than my old diesel. The 300CD definitely doesn't do it.

The synthetic fluid helps smoothen the shifts when it's cold.
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