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#1
09-20-2011, 01:30 AM
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1967 230S W111 Fintail Rally Car Project w/Pics
Hey guys and gals,
I finally took delivery of a floor-shift 4-speed Fintail after years of lusting over vintage rally photos of the model. I banged out some modifications before taking it on its first event, the California Melee, which was last weekend. Below are some photos and video. Hope you guys enjoy the car and I'd love any feedback or suggestions on other modifications for performance and the right look. Here is the link to the event review I wrote up on Bring a Trailer, which has the whole photo album and specs on the car: http://bringatrailer.com/2011/09/13/2011-california-melee-wrapped-up/ Randy N. www.bringatrailer.com San Francisco, Ca   
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#2
09-20-2011, 02:52 AM
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Wow (and welcome to the forum)
__________________
1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver 1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone 1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy! 1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior  Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits!
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#3
09-20-2011, 07:15 AM
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Welcome! And what a nice way of enjoying a W111!
Weight reduction: The best improvement you can do is to fit these aluminum wheels that look like steel ones that were fitted on the W123 Diesels. The 6x14 are quite rare but the 5.5x14 are easier to find. They are less than half the weight of the steel ones and each pound of rotative mass equates to up to eight pounds of static mass. You can also replace the battery by a Braille dry cell one which is half the weight and move it in the trunck for a better weight distribution. You can remove the bumpers. I often see the overriders removed on rally cars in Europe. Seats are heavy. Remove the rear seat. You can also replace the front seats with lighter ones. Handling: New rubber bushings all round and new Billstein shocks will make it a new car. You can go for the poly-bushing kit developed by Cox-racing. It will make the car more precise. Engine - Transmission: You can replace the 230S by a 280S. Nobody will notice and it will bolt straight. You can also go for the injection of the SE for more power. You can go for a Getrag 265 5 speed, an adaptor kit has been developed by the guys on the Pagoda SL Group. This is relevant if you go if you go for a taller rear end as you mentioned. But frankly, I think the one you have may already be the tallest available. (4.11:1?) Brakes you can upgrade with W108 4.5 vented discs and carbone kevlar pads. Keep us posted!
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#4
09-20-2011, 10:54 AM
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Saw your post on BAT. Loved the pics and the Vimeo movie as well. Those old car rallies look like a blast.
GGR - don't think Cox does MB poly bushings any longer. Energy Suspension or one of the big companies prob has these sizes on the shelf.
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#7
09-20-2011, 05:07 PM
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Well,
the rubber bushings I had on the car were all shot, so it's not a fair comparison. But I had a 6.3 some time ago on which I put all new rubber bushings. The 6.3 is much heavier and has air suspension, so here again it's not a proper comparison. Let's say that at high speed my Coupe with poly-bushings is more precise than the 6.3 was. But at low speed and on uneven pavement I feel the bumps and holes much more than with the rubber bushings. I've lost a bit of comfort at low speed in favor of better hanling in general and particularly at high speed. Other upgrades I've made are HD shocks and 6.3 front axle leafs which are shorter and provide for more caster and better guidance at higher speed. I also compressed more the bushings of the rear axle lateral strut to reduce lateral play in heavy cornering.
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#8
09-20-2011, 08:28 PM
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Quote:
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Strelnik Invest in America: Buy a Congressman! 1950 170SD 1951 Citroen 11BN 1953 Citroen 11BNF limo 1953 220a project 1959 180D 1960 190D 1960 Borgward Isabella TS 2dr 1983 240D daily driver 1983 380SL 1990 350SDL daily driver alt 3 x Citroen DS21M, down from 5 3 x Citroen 2CV, down from 6
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#10
09-21-2011, 04:41 PM
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Thanks for the info, guys.
GGR, great stuff. Just what I was looking for. The suspension will stay rubber with new shocks on order. The exhaust system is shot, so I'm about to source one. Are the stainless units out of Florida the best option? Is there benefit to adapting the true dual exhaust out of a 280SE in place of my single? Also, the intake and exhaust manifolds look like ugly beasts. Is there a performance option there? Thanks for all the help! The car is great fun. Randy The best vintage and classic cars for sale online | Bring a Trailer - Barn finds, rally cars, and needles in the haystack.
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#12
09-22-2011, 07:51 AM
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When it comes to engine performance, your greatest bang for the buck would be to swap the engine with a 280S out of a W108. Increasing displacement is the easiest for a road car.
I've seen pictures of tripple side drought Webers set-ups, but I think they were custom made. Never heared of any ready made kit. I you stay with rubber bushings make sure to change them all if it was not done recently. Especially both ends of the rear axle trail arms and the front axle leafs. HD shocks for these cars are the two stripes Billsteins, though I've seen people go with the Pagoda four stripes on these cars. I'm not sure, but I think you would need to replace the front steering knuckles to upgrade to 4.5 vented disks. p/n are different on EPC and I heared it was necessary to swap them. The best is to source a 4.5 complete front end and rebuild it. It will then be a straight swap. You would need to retain your 230 front spings though as engine is lighter. You should contact Steve Walters who ran the Panamericana with a Fintail. I saw his car and he gave me some tips for my Coupe. I will pm you his contact.
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#13
09-23-2011, 05:44 PM
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You really dont need to up grade the brakes,even the drums work well . For the engine, you can go to the M130 280 S .Get the Cam reground to 280SL specs 09 grind. This will allow the engine to rev higher with useable power to 6500 RPM.
There is nothing else required to boost the engine. The intake manifold is the result of many decades of racing experience for Daimler from Before WW2 in fact. The exhaust will breathe miles better if you run the dual pipe set up from a 280SE with a muffler for a 280SE 3.5 on the rear. Install power steering and see if you can dig up a 300SEL 6.3 steering box pitman arm and idler. Get the 6.3's idler mount welded to the chassis (no big deal,it takes around 30 minutes to do the job. This will give faster steering . On the front, install the 300SEL 6.3 spacers between the body mount bush and the chassis . Use either W110 200 (gas) front springs or get new lower springs made. This lowers the cars roll center and enables the car to corner flatter and keep the front tyres grip higher. Use a 280SE 3.5 Front roll bar. Standard Bilstein shock absorbers cannot be beaten unless you go to Koni adjustables. Keep your eyes open for a W112 300SE being parted out and get the LSD diff center . The LSD diffs typically have a plate on the rear of the housing saying "sperrdiferential . Use special oil" You wont want to use the whole W112 diff ,just the diff head. The joy of these cars is that they are cheap and easy to modify with plenty of parts laying about. Here is a Rallying Finny in Australia with Drum brakes . Wakefield - YouTube
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#14
09-23-2011, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Last edited by GGR; 09-23-2011 at 06:18 PM.
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#15
09-24-2011, 02:48 AM
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i am not sure what is in that beetle but it shows what simple tuning can achieve. .
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