Violent Pervert Released in VT. - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

spdrun · #46 07-28-2013, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

You say there's a problem with VT's study and then challenge it with anecdotal experience? Isn't that what studies are supposed to account for?

And again: with Vermont's low crime rates, low incarceration rates, and lack of death penalty in practice, what VT is doing seems to be working.

Botnst · #47 07-28-2013, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

I am not for group punishment either.
And, our Criminal laws are not retroactive. So changing the Law would not effect those already released from Prison.

However, if enough People want stricter sentences they can work to have the Law changed.

Here in CA We have an Initiative Process where if they get enough Signatures from Registered Voters you can get your Initiative
on the Ballot.

CA got the 3-Strikes Law Initiative Process and later deflated the 3-Srike Law some using the same process.

Just because y'all have initiative and use it on state issues doesn't mean it will become law in your state.

t walgamuth · #48 07-28-2013, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

You say there's a problem with VT's study and then challenge it with anecdotal experience? Isn't that what studies are supposed to account for?

Not at all. I pointed out a point that I believe to be true, that there are a lot more molestations that don't get reported than do.

The rest is my observations... not intended to prove the first point at all.

MTI · #49 07-28-2013, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Not at all. I pointed out a point that I believe to be true, that there are a lot more molestations that don't get reported than do.

The rest is my observations... not intended to prove the first point at all.

Got a link . . . where have I heard that before? There's certainly credence to under reporting of ALL crimes, but do you have any studies or reports which makes VT's studies invalid?

t walgamuth · #50 07-28-2013, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

Got a link . . . where have I heard that before? There's certainly credence to under reporting of ALL crimes, but do you have any studies or reports which makes VT's studies invalid?

I didn't say their study Is invalid, I just said it does not tell the whole story.

aklim · #51 07-29-2013, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

I didn't say their study Is invalid, I just said it does not tell the whole story.

OK. What's the rest of story, Paul Harvey?

Diesel911 · #52 07-29-2013, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

Just because y'all have initiative and use it on state issues doesn't mean it will become law in your state.

So because we'all might fail when we'all shouldn't try to change the Law; if we think that is the thing to do?

I know out here apparently a lot of People that voted for the original 3-strkes law did not read and understand what they had voted for.

The first time it was used was when some previously convicted Felon took a piece of Pizza from a Kid down at one of our shopping areas near the Beach. Sent to Jail for life because it was another Felony.
Unfortunately the Defendant was a Black Man and that made it more controversial.

Many of the Voters had only expected the Law would be used against People committing another Violent Felony. But, that was not so.

So they got it back on the Ballot to change it. I am not sure what they deleted from the Law.

I thought the Original 3 Strike Law was doing what it said it was going to do and was OK with it. The Idea was to serve Notice on the repeated Felon that cause more Felony that was it for them.
The problem is that you need sobriety in order to make a decision not to fall back into your own ways or choose not to do something.
Hence the Guy went to Jail for the Pizza theft and People thought that was unfair.

Diesel911 · #53 07-29-2013, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

Got a link . . . where have I heard that before? There's certainly credence to under reporting of ALL crimes, but do you have any studies or reports which makes VT's studies invalid?

If something is unreported why would there be a statistical list that would be accurate that could be posted on a site? There would only be a guess based on People who did not report until later in their life.

Not unlike the issue with the Priests Molesting Boys they go un-reported for years after the fact.
That also happens with Family Members who Molested other Family Members.

t walgamuth · #54 07-29-2013, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

OK. What's the rest of story, Paul Harvey?

The rest of the story is that not many five year olds report their molestations to anybody.

MTI · #55 07-29-2013, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

The rest of the story is that not many five year olds report their molestations to anybody.

Wouldn't that be true of nearly all crimes? Which would suggest that all crime statistics are invalid. However, of those that are reported, wouldn't that suggest that changes in those statistics would probably indicate valid trends?

t walgamuth · #56 07-29-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

Wouldn't that be true of nearly all crimes? Which would suggest that all crime statistics are invalid. However, of those that are reported, wouldn't that suggest that changes in those statistics would probably indicate valid trends?

What other crimes are done in secret to children in privacy and often by people the children know and often love?

Why are you diminishing the significance of this violent and heinous crime against children?

MTI · #57 07-29-2013, 11:02 AM

Sorry Tom, I'm not "diminishing the significance" of any violent crime, just trying to find out what your statement about the studies is based on. If studies can only include "reported" incidents, doesn't that allow those studies to be comparable?

Diesel911 · #58 07-29-2013, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

Wouldn't that be true of nearly all crimes? Which would suggest that all crime statistics are invalid. However, of those that are reported, wouldn't that suggest that changes in those statistics would probably indicate valid trends?

I think that would depend on if the crimes/alleged crimes were investigated or not.

Someone said; "there is Lies, Dam Lies and then there is Statistics".

Botnst · #59 07-29-2013, 07:44 PM

Benjamin Disraeli.

t walgamuth · #60 07-29-2013, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI

Sorry Tom, I'm not "diminishing the significance" of any violent crime, just trying to find out what your statement about the studies is based on. If studies can only include "reported" incidents, doesn't that allow those studies to be comparable?

Do you have children?