New here, looking for any advice on 240D/190D - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

spliteye · #1 04-12-2014, 04:54 AM

Looks like my post did show up on the last page.

Last question and I'll lay this to rest. Are the injection pumps serviceable on these cars? My Ford's pump is to be replaced every 100K, along with the injectors, according to Ford and International. This is to prevent the pump from becoming inefficient, resulting in low power and poor fuel economy. I figured that was bull, however mine ended up going at around 130K. Since it's been replaced, the truck can actually climb hills with the flow of traffic. That just wasn't happening before the pump replacement.

I hear the Mercedes pumps last the life of the engine. Say it did fail before said time came. Can I service it myself, or is a rebuilt my only option?

Thanks,
Dan

Maxbumpo · #2 04-14-2014, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spliteye

Looks like my post did show up on the last page.

Last question and I'll lay this to rest. Are the injection pumps serviceable on these cars? My Ford's pump is to be replaced every 100K, along with the injectors, according to Ford and International. This is to prevent the pump from becoming inefficient, resulting in low power and poor fuel economy. I figured that was bull, however mine ended up going at around 130K. Since it's been replaced, the truck can actually climb hills with the flow of traffic. That just wasn't happening before the pump replacement.

I hear the Mercedes pumps last the life of the engine. Say it did fail before said time came. Can I service it myself, or is a rebuilt my only option?

Thanks,
Dan

You can rebuild the delivery valves (replace a copper washer, spring, and O-ring) and replace the vacuum shut-off valve and various other O-rings that might start leaking. There is a "lift pump" which pulls the fuel from the fuel tank and provides it at low pressure to the injection pump, and also a hand-operated primer pump (incorporated into the lift pump) that is a wear item and user-replaceable.

Typically they do last the life of the car unless "repaired" by someone who has no business...

They hold the injection timing forever as well, so no need to check-adjust the timing as a regular maintenance item.

Worst case scenario: your options are either buy a rebuilt or replace with a good used pump. I prefer to the second route, but I've never had to go down that decision tree yet, after about 14 years of used MB diesel ownership. IP's which have seen VO or WVO as fuel generally are destroyed, can't even be turned in for core to be rebuilt, so if you ever do get a used replacement pump, screen those out if possible.

spliteye · #3 04-14-2014, 09:52 PM

Time to break out the quote button.

Quote:

Originally Posted by strelnik

I have had 4 240D in the last ten years as communter cars. All had been neglected by previous owners. Things to check and/or replace (Notice all are basic maintenance tasks):

Check the fuel system filters, the cigar tube hose, the hoses in the engine compartment and the return line rubber hoses between inujectors.

Replace the body grounds (-) with a short one to the body and a second one to the rear of the engine block.

Carefully and thoroughly oil and maintain your hood hinges before they rust and deform the sheet metal! Replace the starter cable

Buy the two bent wrenches to adjust the valves and get the Diesel Giant information sheet on valve adjustment procedure with photos. Download free!

Clean all ground and other electrical connections to the alternator as well as alternator adjustment screrw. I replaced my alternator with one from a Volvo, same as the W126, I believe.

Check over the brakes and probably replace the rubber hoses, sometimes they collapse.

Change oil religiously and bear in mind that a 240 will suck oil if you drive over 80 in it.

BEST ADVICE: KEEP IT TO 70 MPH max!

Do these things the car will outlive you.

At the right time, get an older vehicle and go to the MB dealer, get the mileage verified and request a 250,000 km badge (after 165,000 miles).

Have fun!

Great advice, which all looks fairly easy to do. I'm actually looking forward to the badges. I didn't know what they represented until just a couple days ago.

On a side note, does your signature say that you have/have owned a Borgward? That's been a dream car of mine since I was in the fifth grade. I remember writing reports for them in school with Borgward as the topic, or writing stories that included a Borgward as the subject. They were a major obsession of mine as a child. Here I am 23, and I still find myself looking for them every once in a while.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

You can rebuild the delivery valves (replace a copper washer, spring, and O-ring) and replace the vacuum shut-off valve and various other O-rings that might start leaking. There is a "lift pump" which pulls the fuel from the fuel tank and provides it at low pressure to the injection pump, and also a hand-operated primer pump (incorporated into the lift pump) that is a wear item and user-replaceable.

Typically they do last the life of the car unless "repaired" by someone who has no business...

They hold the injection timing forever as well, so no need to check-adjust the timing as a regular maintenance item.

Worst case scenario: your options are either buy a rebuilt or replace with a good used pump. I prefer to the second route, but I've never had to go down that decision tree yet, after about 14 years of used MB diesel ownership. IP's which have seen VO or WVO as fuel generally are destroyed, can't even be turned in for core to be rebuilt, so if you ever do get a used replacement pump, screen those out if possible.

This is something I was really concerned about. The corn binder in my truck requires complete injection system overhaul every 100K, which ended up running me over $1300. These pumps can't be rebuilt in your garage, or I would have done it. At least the truck can climb hills now. It's nice to know that the Mercedes ip can be rebuilt by someone with some knowledge of mechanics.

Thanks once again,
Dan

Shortsguy1 · #4 04-14-2014, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

IP's which have seen VO or WVO as fuel generally are destroyed, can't even be turned in for core to be rebuilt, so if you ever do get a used replacement pump, screen those out if possible.

Maxbumpo, could you clarify this statement regarding the virgin vegetable oil? I am surprised that pristine vegetable oil would cause significant problems with the IP. Have you seen repeated failures due to using VO? Is it a lubricity issue or a viscosity issue? Thanks.

crazy4diesel · #5 04-10-2014, 12:37 PM

My pick would probably be the 190D 2.5, manual. If you could find one, that's not been abused by some college kid who's idea of maintenance is filling the radiator with water. I remember road test reviewing these cars when they came out, and they were fantastic! Fun to drive, quite, very good on fuel, and very tightly built (actually, better than some other M-B cars at the time, as Mercedes was intent on this "baby benz" being perceived as the genuine article).

A common problem with the 190's as they were passed down to neglectful kids pretty frequently (at least by the condition I see most of these cars in, it's clear someone owned them with a "disposable car" attitude).

A nice clean, lower mileage, well maintained 240D manual would be hard to beat, for ease of repair.

75Sv1 · #6 04-10-2014, 12:49 PM

I think the main concensus is a 'well maintianed' car. Mine had a good body. The interior looked bad. It cleaned up though. I went through a lot of the stuff. Still have the front end to do. It was aprtially done by the previous owner. I probably have 5K to 8K into it. 240D. It probably would have been better to get a $5K car or such. Mine probably has $300K on it. I did some engine work, but not a rebuild.
I like my 240D for the short drive to work. It will get up to 70 75 mph farily easy. Its a manual 4spd. If it where a 5 spd, and a bit better seats, then longer trips would be OK. Maybe when I get the front end done, and see about the seats, my opinon might change. It is soothing to drive though. Meditation of 4 wheels. No radio, only rap is the deisel.
Tom

ichris93 · #7 04-10-2014, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazy4diesel

If you could find one, that's not been abused by some college kid who's idea of maintenance is filling the radiator with water.

A common problem with the 190's as they were passed down to neglectful kids pretty frequently (at least by the condition I see most of these cars in, it's clear someone owned them with a "disposable car" attitude).

Yeah, find one that was taken car of by a college kid like me. My 190 would likely be in a junk yard if it was not for me. My 240 would be in worse shape too.

crazy4diesel · #8 04-10-2014, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichris93

Yeah, find one that was taken car of by a college kid like me. My 190 would likely be in a junk yard if it was not for me. My 240 would be in worse shape too.

Like all metaphors, and similes nothing absolute was intended.

ichris93 · #9 04-10-2014, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazy4diesel

Like all metaphors, and similes nothing absolute was intended.

No harm; makes me feel better when I am above the status quo of college students.

pj67coll · #10 04-10-2014, 11:53 PM

For the OP, or anyone else contemplating a 240D. I've just posted a thread here in the diesel section detailing my 240D's fuel log and maintenance history. Bear in mind that this was a 1300 dollar car for me and if it were not for my stupidity I would still be driving it. Real bedtime reading

- Peter.

spliteye · #11 04-11-2014, 12:18 AM

Lots of good information here. Thank you for taking the time.

Would anyone mind taking a look at these listings and mentioning what they think of them? I'm not necessarily looking to buy this month, but I feel it would be good to keep an eye out and have the experts give their opinions.

This one is priced at the higher end of the spectrum, however it looks like there may be a reason for it. Unfortunately, it is an automatic:
1983 Mercedes-Benz 240D *NewTrans/RebuiltEng/2Owner**DIESEL/AUTOMATIC*

My favorite, however it's miles are undocumented and it needs a few weekends of elbow grease:
1974 240D Diesel w/ Manual Transmission OVERHAULED

Looks clean:
1983 Mercedes 240d 4 speed manual

Here are a couple 190Ds:

Looks clean, but automatic:
1986 Mercedes 190D DIESEL

Not as clean, but a few less miles:
1986 Mercedes Benz 190D diesel none turbo

Why not throw in a 300D:

Is it rare to have a manual in a 300D?
1984 Mercedes-Benz 300D Sedan Blue, Classic, Great Shape

As for the automatic, I'd much rather have a manual for this drive, however I have an injured left leg. I guess this is a good time to ask how stiff these clutches are? As long as they aren't as stiff as the ones in 300 hp+ cars, I'm ok.

Thanks again,
Dan

t walgamuth · #12 04-10-2014, 06:43 PM

The 83 and 82 240D's were pretty rust resistant.

bill murrow · #13 04-10-2014, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

The 83 and 82 240D's were pretty rust resistant.

Yeah my '83 doesn't have much rust at all but my '81 parts car is real rusty even though it was garage kept for 20 years.

Skippy · #14 04-15-2014, 03:40 PM

If the oil isn't properly heated before it goes in, it doesn't atomize properly or burn completely. It ends up forming a gummy substance that makes the piston rings stick and causes the engine to lose compression. There is also the matter of the excessive viscosity causing higher stresses and faster wear in the injection pump and injectors. We've also seen corrosion issues but I'm not sure if those happen with new veg oil or only with WVO.

Ask Cooljjay about the effects of veg on an engine.

ROLLGUY · #15 04-15-2014, 05:11 PM

Please don't allow this to become a WVO battle thread. There is plenty of that going on in the alt. fuels forum. I have a lot to say about this subject (many years of experience), but this is not the proper place, so I will keep quiet here. However, there is always personal messaging

.....Rich