What's inside that MANN oil filter? Taking it to bits... - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

vstech · #1 01-11-2014, 11:15 PM

now we need someone to tear into a purolator, and a fram and compare them

Mölyapina · #2 01-11-2014, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjts1

Looks well built.

Meh. Not terribly impressed -- as OM617Yota's photos more clearly show this thing has dirt in it. Filtering dirt with dirt seems pointless, especially if the thing isn't fully sealed, which it isn't at the bottom of the large cylinder. Here is OM617Yota's description of what's in the filter. He has better pictures of the junk.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

now we need someone to tear into a purolator, and a fram and compare them

If someone gets them for me, I'll do it

.

tjts1 · #3 01-12-2014, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna

Meh. Not terribly impressed -- as OM617Yota's photos more clearly show this thing has dirt in it. Filtering dirt with dirt seems pointless, especially if the thing isn't fully sealed, which it isn't at the bottom of the large cylinder. Here is OM617Yota's description of what's in the filter.

As others pointed out in the other thread, some bypass filters use dirt and saw dust in bypass filters for million mile trucks. Mann is by far the best stock filter you can buy for your engine.

Mölyapina · #4 01-12-2014, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjts1

As others pointed out in the other thread, some bypass filters use dirt and saw dust in bypass filters for million mile trucks. Mann is by far the best stock filter you can buy for your engine.

OK, so I don't know how much -- if any -- difference clean cotton makes, but if it's available at a CHEAPER price than the MANN and isn't deficient in filtration otherwise... why go with the dirty? Furthermore, why call it the the best? That seems strange.

ROLLGUY · #5 01-12-2014, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna

Meh. Not terribly impressed -- as OM617Yota's photos more clearly show this thing has dirt in it. Filtering dirt with dirt seems pointless, especially if the thing isn't fully sealed, which it isn't at the bottom of the large cylinder. Here is OM617Yota's description of what's in the filter. He has better pictures of the junk.

If someone gets them for me, I'll do it

.

From the other thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsxr

Exactly. Why wring your hands and lose sleep over five bucks per filter, when a replacement used engine is easily $1-$2k...? Seriously, WTH?

OM60x filter p/n 601-180-01-09 is $14 MSRP and can be found at the various OE interweb dealers for $9-$11... for Genuine Mercedes. Aftermarket is... uh-oh... $9-$11 at Pelican, and OE is $14 at Pelican.

It ain't worth the debate, just use OE.

Why would there be small bits of metal in the OE filter? Yes the cotton looks cleaner, but it still looks like cotton gin waste to me, and not a good thing to filter oil through because of the metal. I could be wrong on this, as maybe the cloth on both sides of the cotton core may not allow the dirt and metal bits to get in the engine. I have been using NAPA filters with gold colored pleats the entire length of the filter. I don't care for their top Oring, as it does not fit tight on the cover, and is a little tricky to hold on while sliding the cover in place. After looking at that junk even in the OE filter, I will stick with the NAPA GOLD filter.....Rich

tangofox007 · #6 01-12-2014, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROLLGUY

Why would there be small bits of metal in the OE filter?

Could it be because the filter was doing what a filter is supposed to do?

ROLLGUY · #7 01-12-2014, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tangofox007

Could it be because the filter was doing what a filter is supposed to do?

I just asked myself this question: "Was the photo of a new or used filter?" Answer: I have to admit that looking back at the photos, it does look like new filters unopened, and a used filter cut open (with metal bits).
At first I thought it was the same filter, but now I see a used and new filter in the photos....Rich

EDIT: The text on the photo says "OE filter from the dealer", so I assumed that the photo was of a "new" OE filter from the dealer.

RunningTooHot · #8 01-13-2014, 01:16 AM

I screwed up earlier today and posted the following in the wrong (earlier) thread:

Side tangent? Same (basic) engine, but DIFFERENT filter designs!

I just bought a '98 w210 yesterday with a turbo OM606 engine. I also have a '95 w124 with the normally aspirated OM606 engine.

While creating a parts list for the new car, I noticed that the oil filter is a pleated ONLY design - there is no "tin can" section at all. Conversely, the filter for the 1995 NA 606 has the tin can section. Just to confuse things more, I looked up the filter for a '96 w210 which has the NA 606 (like the '95 124) - and it uses the pleated only design.

Hmmmmmm......

RunningTooHot · #9 01-13-2014, 01:34 AM

The “pleated only” vs. “combination” filters being factory designated for the same basic engine family was pointed out to indicate that this could all be a bit more esoteric than we realize.

While I would never advocate NO filter like the ’53 chevy truck mentioned in the other thread, “fine particle” filtering capabilities came more into play as oil additive packages, machining tolerances, and engine metallurgy became better & better, and therefore drain intervals became longer.

On many of the race engines I used to build (Super Vee’s, Cosworth BDD’s (Formula Atlantic), and various small-bore SCCA stuff) we oftentimes used “Oberg” oil filters. Those were essentially a flat metal screen sandwiched between two aluminum plates. They would catch “the big chunks”, but nothing else. No problem because the oil was changed every race weekend.

I don’t know if anyone remembers this, but years ago there were bypass filters that used toilet paper rolls as a filtration media. (!) They were advertised as a way to extend the oil change intervals to a ridiculous level, or to NEVER change your oil again if used with (early) synthetic oils. This was obviously long before us mere mortals knew anything about additive packages & depletion. Does anybody remember “Arco Graphite” oil? That would be an interesting combo – a toilet paper filter & Arco Graphite. Talk about constipation….

ROLLGUY · #10 01-13-2014, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunningTooHot

I screwed up earlier today and posted the following in the wrong (earlier) thread:

Side tangent? Same (basic) engine, but DIFFERENT filter designs!

I just bought a '98 w210 yesterday with a turbo OM606 engine. I also have a '95 w124 with the normally aspirated OM606 engine.

While creating a parts list for the new car, I noticed that the oil filter is a pleated ONLY design - there is no "tin can" section at all. Conversely, the filter for the 1995 NA 606 has the tin can section. Just to confuse things more, I looked up the filter for a '96 w210 which has the NA 606 (like the '95 124) - and it uses the pleated only design.

Hmmmmmm......

I think the difference may be because of the fact that the '98 requires synthetic oil and has the oil condition computer monitor thing (whatever it is called), but the '95 does not. A less restrictive (full flow?) filter was needed for synthetic?. Just throwing out ideas here. I also remember the difference in the housing cover. The '95 had an aluminum cover and used the "tin can" filter, and the '98 has a plastic cover and uses a completely different pleated only filter. Having both cars, I had to remember to get different filters as well.

Diesel911 · #11 01-13-2014, 03:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunningTooHot

I screwed up earlier today and posted the following in the wrong (earlier) thread:

Side tangent? Same (basic) engine, but DIFFERENT filter designs!

I just bought a '98 w210 yesterday with a turbo OM606 engine. I also have a '95 w124 with the normally aspirated OM606 engine.

While creating a parts list for the new car, I noticed that the oil filter is a pleated ONLY design - there is no "tin can" section at all. Conversely, the filter for the 1995 NA 606 has the tin can section. Just to confuse things more, I looked up the filter for a '96 w210 which has the NA 606 (like the '95 124) - and it uses the pleated only design.

Hmmmmmm......

In the Old days there was 2 Tiolet Paper Bypass Oil Filters/Cleaners that were well know.

The Frantz is still made and the New and used ones can be had on Ebay. Even the used ones are not cheap.

The Guy that made the Motorguards got tired of the critisizm and stopped making them for use on Engines.
The new Motorguards are made for dewatering and Filterering Compressed Air.
And, I was told by one of the Members that they cannot be used as Oil Filters because they now have Plastic Parts inside that do not hold up to Hot Oil.

On US and Austrailian Ebay there is a Filter Called the Jackmaster that uses Toilet Paper and is still being sold.

Gulfcoast has Bypass Oil Flters that can uses Paper Towel Rolls or Toilet Paper. However, they have their own Elements and claim they are presently used on Commercial Vehicles as Oil and Hydraulic Filters.

There has been a bunch of other Makers Oil Filters that can use Toilet Paper Elements for Car and Pickup Truck sized Vehicles but they don't seem to have caught on like the Frantz did.

Do a Google image Search for Toilet Paper Oil Filter and see what you come up with.

There is High End Bypass Oil Filters that have sort of time release Addatives built into the Filter Elements.

gsxr · #12 01-13-2014, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROLLGUY

Why would there be small bits of metal in the OE filter? Yes the cotton looks cleaner, but it still looks like cotton gin waste to me, and not a good thing to filter oil through because of the metal.

I should have clarified. Those photos are from a USED filter, after a vacuum pump explosion dumped massive amounts of metallic debris into the oil pan. I cut open the filter to see what was inside. That is why metal was in the filter - it was doing its job. Details on the vac pump explosion are in this thread, more photos are here.

Sorry, I don't have any photos of a new, OE Genuine Mercedes filter cut apart.

Diesel911 · #13 01-12-2014, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

now we need someone to tear into a purolator, and a fram and compare them

My Pics from the Purolator L43056 I got from PepBoys 4 years or so ago are in one of the 3 large Oil fiter Threads.

The Filter was made in India and the Cotton Gin that was inside was not terribly firmly packed.

It had more of the typical Trash in it and the Cotton was poorer than the other that people have cut apart.

Worse the central inside Tube is not sealed on the Bottom like the Onter makes it is just the Metal Tube sitting on the Metal Bottom.
The STP Filter that Autozone was selling was also made in India and it looked to be the same Filter.

But, they could have change how the make them since then.

I hope you can see the pics in post #278
OIL FILTERS: which one to buy????

funola · #14 01-12-2014, 12:30 AM

The cotton junk probably does a better job of trapping and holding a larger capacity of contaminants than a pleated filter. The Mann filter has a pleated paper section, the sotton I assume for coarse filtering, the pleated paper for finer filtering.

Mölyapina · #15 01-12-2014, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by funola

The cotton junk probably does a better job of trapping and holding a larger capacity of contaminants than a pleated filter. The Mann filter has a pleated paper section, the sotton I assume for coarse filtering, the pleated paper for finer filtering.

Might be the case, but then why don't we have the filtration capabilities somewhere. I'd buy it if I could find what it's rated to filter. I will grant them that they PACKED that sucker.

I'm going to fire off an e-mail to them and see if I have better luck than Diesel911.