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#1
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Calling transmission gurus: 1980 300td with 722.1 won't go into 2nd
I have posted some of this before in other threads, but the subject wasn't as focused as it might have been. So here is my last crack at it:
1. My 1980 has the "vacuum-only" transmission. No linkage connected to the throttle. When I got the car last fall it revved way to high to shift into 2nd, then stack-shifted into 3 immediately. 2. The car had sat for some time so I decided to drive it a bit before looking into the shifting. After a few days it suddenly started shifting much better when warmed up, just a bit of slip into 3. 3. Then without warning it stopped going into 2nd. Winds up in 1st and if you back off the throttle it just loses drive entirely until you slow down a bit. Then gives a slippy first. If you roll to a stop it goes back nicely into first. 4. I checked the main vacuum line and output was low. Changed the pump diaphragm this weekend, turned out the old one was probably fine but was installed wrong side in and the cover was barely locked in place. Road test, no difference. Tried swapping around vacuum lines in case they were misrouted (there is a post in this somewhere). Road test, no diff. 5. Then installed a new vacuum splitter valve (the white valve on the VC). Road test, no difference. At this point the predicted fine day turned into a nasty afternoon of thundersorms so that was it for the weekend. 6. The buddy who was helping me (he having small hands, me not) wants to try switching over the modulator valve from my parts tranny, next weekend. I figure at this point it's a waste of effort. In need of ideas. Maybe I should just swap in the known good 'regular' used tranny from my old 240d, and install the linkages to make it work. This is getting very old and the car needs much other attention that I'm not getting to.... Thanks
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Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
#2
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I wouldn't do any parts swapping without monitoring the actual vacuum levels going to the transmission. T into the line going to the transmission, hook a mityvac into it and run the mityvac out the hood at the cowl and shut the hood, leaving the mity vac gauge visible thru the windshield. Drive around monitoring the vacuum level and report back the levels you are finding. Without knowing what amount of vacuum is going to the transmission you're just shooting in the dark.
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1977 300d 70k--sold 08 1985 300TD 185k+ 1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03 1985 409d 65k--sold 06 1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car 1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11 1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper 1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4 1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13 |
#3
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First check to see if your modulator holds vacuum. If it does not leak, then do what Kerry suggests.
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All Diesel Fleet 1985 R107 300SLD TURBODIESEL 2005 E320 CDI (daily) LOTS of parts for sale! EGR block kit http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/355250-sale-egr-delete-block-off-plate-kit.html 1985 CA emissions 617 owners- You Need This! Sanden style A/C Compressor Mounting Kit for your 616/ 617 For Sale + Install Inst. Sanden Instalation Guide (post 11): http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/367883-sanden-retrofit-installation-guide.html |
#4
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Vacuum to the modulator is a factor in how the transmission shifts, not whether it shifts.
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#5
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What controls whether the transmission shifts?
Remember this trans has no Bowden cable or throttle linkage connection. So what controls it? I have asked this before, in relation to THIS particular trans, but got no response.... Tks
__________________
Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
#6
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Is that the case on the 'vacuum only' transmission?
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08 1985 300TD 185k+ 1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03 1985 409d 65k--sold 06 1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car 1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11 1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper 1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4 1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13 |
#7
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Nail. Head. Bang. THANK YOU.
If vacuum isn't controlling it, what is, some sort of internal governor?
__________________
Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
#8
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Quote:
My guess at the moment is that it is done by the "extra" valves in the valve body that I couldn't identify when I took it to bits... I've nearly finished my write up - though I now feel obliged to write about how the sodding thing works! Take a look at the other thread - could be B1...
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1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver 1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone 1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy! 1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits! |
#9
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When you accelerate hard in 1st gear, does the speedo register?
If NOT, possibly the nut on the output flange could be loose. Then the governor will not work as well.
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MERCEDES Benz Master Guild Technician (6 TIMES) ASE Master Technician Mercedes Benz Star Technician (2 times) 44 years foreign automotive repair 27 Years M.B. Shop foreman (dealer) MB technical information Specialist (15 years) 190E 2.3 16V ITS SCCA race car (sold) 1986 190E 2.3 16V 2.5 (sold) Retired Moderator |
#10
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Yes it's working normally.
Tks
__________________
Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
#11
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Aha
Found this interesting thread....
722.118 first gear only This would suggest the modulator does have a bigger role on this model of transmission. The last entry also mentions the governor.
__________________
Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
#12
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I am really really confused Zacharias...
Please can you tell me what is going on?
In this thread you are saying that the transmission is stuck in first but In this thread you say it isn't WTB: complete set of linkages for w123 300d non-turbo Quote:
Is there any chance you can make a video? By the way as for the last comment in this thread:- 722.118 first gear only I don't see how you could reach the governor from the outside of the transmission. You can pull out the secondary pump but that's as far as I can see anyone getting 722.1 Secondary pump special tool
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1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver 1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone 1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy! 1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits! |
#13
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Condensed info:
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w123-e-ce-d-cd-td/1597891-diy-w123-transmission-diagnose-adjustment-722-a.html
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http://www.venganza.org/images/fsmrof.png I only use B100 made out of recycled cooking oil under ASTM D6751 standards, from Sirona Biofuels in Oakland, CA. Currently $3.90 gal. MANN/BOSCH filters. Chevron Delo 400 15w40 or Castrol equivalent, planning to use Bio-Synthetic HD SHP Motor Oil SAE 15W40 next. |
#14
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I have an '81 240d, vacuum only transmission.
My modulator was leaking, pulling up transmission fluid into the vacuum line preventing vacuum from reaching the modulator. To shift properly it rev'ed up and I had to back off the pedal and it would shift hard into gears. New modulator fixed it. |
#15
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Quote:
My lack of precision in my language describing a problem no doubt reflects a pitiful lack of understanding of what goes on inside an auto trans. So here goes: When you take off it winds up in first. I have taken it to just before the warning dot on the speedo and it does not shift up. If you take it to near the warning dot and back off the pedal it slips into neutral until the road speed decreases, then it engages first again. I did say before it was going into second and slipping, but either I was mistaken or that is no longer the case. On the weekend I drove it further than I had attempted previously and I only had forward drive in first. However on previous occasions I was sure I had some very limited forward drive when I backed off the throttle, albeit with HUGE slippage. By the way it engages both drive and reverse instantly from a stop. No hesitation. If you want other info, please ask specific questions.
__________________
Mac 2002 e320 4matic estate│1985 300d│1980 300td Previous: 1979 & 1982 & 1983 300sd │ 1982 240d “Let's take a drive into the middle of nowhere with a packet of Marlboro lights and talk about our lives.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22 |
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